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Grand Prix thread SINGAPORE AIRLINES SINGAPORE GRAND PRIX 2023

Discussion in 'Formula 1' started by ched999uk, Sep 14, 2023.

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Who will finish first?

Poll closed Sep 16, 2023.
  1. Max Verstappen

    44.4%
  2. Charles Leclerc

    11.1%
  3. Fernando Alonso

    11.1%
  4. Sergio Perez

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. Lewis Hamilton

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  6. George Russell

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  7. Carlos Sainz

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. Lando Norris

    22.2%
  9. Pierre Gasly

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  10. Any Other

    11.1%
  1. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    Unless you've had to live with 'the sins of your father', you wouldn't get his attitude.
     
    #21
  2. Julius Caesar

    Julius Caesar Well-Known Member
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    It's been the second best car on average. Lance is 9th in the standings, regularly out in Q1/Q2 and hasn't had a sniff at a podium all season.

    I'm not saying he's the worst driver of all time. Logan Sargeant is worse than him and Stroll would be inoffensive as the second driver for Williams or Haas. But that's not where he is. Alonso is a tough teammate, but it think Ocon's performances in the last two years show that's not a reasonable excuse.

    Even with Grosjean (who i agree was not great), i'd say the second half of his 2013 season was better than anything Lance has produced. Also Romain has actually outqualified a teammate over a season, something Stroll couldn't manage even against Sirotkin.
     
    #22
  3. ched999uk

    ched999uk Well-Known Member

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    Red Bulls suffering understeer! It's looking more like they have been effected by the Flexi wing TD!
     
    #23
  4. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    lol, that's just utter bullshit, the AM has not been the 2nd best car on average, maybe Alonso's results have, but only a fool would say it's a better car than the Ferrari has been over the season.
     
    #24
  5. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    lol, both RBRs out, on pace.
    No flexi-wing, no party, do they have the money to fix it?
     
    #25
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  6. Julius Caesar

    Julius Caesar Well-Known Member
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    A bit of recency bias there. The Ferrari has had higher peaks, but were absolutely nowhere for many many races.

    If the current form continues they'll have been better by the end of the year, but for now i still consider the AM better on average. I don't buy the Alonso god narrative. He's 41 and spent the last two years in a tight battle with Ocon. He a top driver, but wouldn't be trashing Leclerc or Sainz.
     
    #26
  7. Julius Caesar

    Julius Caesar Well-Known Member
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    It'll be pretty soul crushing if Red Bull still win this one.

    Surely this time it's the end of the streak
     
    #27
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  8. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    yeah, Ocon got his great race result on talent alone, nothing to do with a timely SC or Alonso's magnificent defensive driving at all.
     
    #28
  9. Julius Caesar

    Julius Caesar Well-Known Member
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    Less about one result. More about Alonso being 23-20 in Qualifying and 17-17 in two car finishes vs Ocon over two seasons.

    Alonso had worse luck and would have deserved to beat Ocon, but it was close.
     
    #29
  10. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    I got the wrong year too, lol, it was '21 Ocon had his freak win. I still think Stroll is far better than most will give him credit for, not saying he's championship material though, just a lower midfield driver that isn't out of place in F1.
     
    #30

  11. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    He just seems to act particularly spoilt .
     
    #31
  12. push

    push Well-Known Member

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    Horner has denied that the TD has had anything to do with the loss of performance.Well he would say that , wouldn`t he?
     
    #32
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  13. Viva_Giggsy

    Viva_Giggsy Well-Known Member

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    Remember when Mercedes were dominating they always seemed to struggle in Singapore, Red Bull probably be the same.
     
    #33
  14. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    Max was off it here last season too wasn't he? It's hard to really tell what effect this has had on RBR, but I don't think it's going to be a massive drop off, if any.
     
    #34
  15. Justjazz

    Justjazz Well-Known Member

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    Hmm, my thoughts,
    First, really pleased to see Sainz getting the better of Le Clerc. Not everyone agreed with me but i do think he is likely the better of the two, just through attitude.
    RBR, if the TD has messed with their performance does that mean their car was illegal but hard to prove.
    Lawson, his performance is such that I am doubting Danny will race again. Danny has kind of messed up his chance I feel. If so a shame but only himself to blame.

    Looking forward to the race.
     
    #35
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  16. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    I would assume that all cars passed tests previously, so were legal until this point.
     
    #36
  17. ched999uk

    ched999uk Well-Known Member

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    That's the issue though. The rules state that aero surfaces should not be movable. If red bulls (or any other teams) wings or other bodywork was designed to flex then even if it passes the test it should be declared illegal as that's a moveable aero surface.

    I doubt FIA would do anything as the results would bring the sport into disrepute and give them such bad press. I think it's one of these things that just gets brushed under the carpet to keep up the pretence of everyone playing by the rules.

    I don't believe Red Bull where/are the only team designing flexi bodywork, maybe they where just the best at it and using it on many surfaces.
     
    #37
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  18. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    Nah, they never penalize stuff like that. If they did then teams would be reluctant to push their luck though. But that's kinda the teams job in such tight regs, find those areas where you can engineer an advantage and dance the line of legality.
     
    #38
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  19. Justjazz

    Justjazz Well-Known Member

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    Guess we will know more after the next circuit.
     
    #39
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  20. moreinjuredthanowen

    moreinjuredthanowen Mr Brightside

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    Thank god its Singapore and I really hope safety car doesn't help the brat.

    Let's see acnew winner finally.

    But what a brat
     
    #40
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