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2022-23 Season

Discussion in 'Norwich City' started by RiverEndRick, May 30, 2022.

  1. Walsh.i.am

    Walsh.i.am Well-Known Member
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    I feel sorry for Sara.
    A bit like RvW, he's probably our most talented player, yet it doesn't seem like any real attempt has been made to build - or even base the starting line ups around him and his strengths.
    I suspect he'll be gone during the summer window - and who can blame him if he does go?
     
    #641
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  2. RiverEndRick

    RiverEndRick Well-Known Member

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    I still think the difference in recent matches comes from the changes in key positions, particularly Marquinhos and Idah replacing Dowell and Hernandez. As Ben Lee concludes at the end of his tactical analysis:

    "But it was in the final third that Norwich struggled the most; they lacked quality and positional depth in these areas. Ultimately, Sheffield United were able to create better chances than Norwich. While I don't doubt that David Wagner's impact has been a positive one, Norwich's recent performances have been far from ideal. Tactically, Norwich are in a better position than they were under Dean Smith, but that doesn't mean there aren't problems to solve."

    Until we have the right players in the right positions, Wagner will struggle to make his tactical improvements succeed.
     
    #642
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  3. GozoCanary

    GozoCanary Well-Known Member

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    Did anyone ever ask Wagner why we didn't follow up the Sara-McLean-Sorensen (or A.N.Other) formation in midfield? It seemed to work quite well, or at least much better than the alternatives in the last few games.
     
    #643
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  4. Robbie BB

    Robbie BB Well-Known Member

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    So what do you think is his best position and what starting lineup would best suit him playing in that position?
     
    #644
  5. RiverEndRick

    RiverEndRick Well-Known Member

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    Sara was at the heart of Wagner's tactics when things were going well. He played the forward pivot ahead of McLean, supported by the FBs on the flanks. He would drop back when the ball was lost and then provide the extra man to progress the ball out of defence. Ahead of him were Dowell, Hernandez, Sargent and Pukki producing clever movement up front to create and then spaces as defenders were drawn out of position. That has floundered of late because the coordination with Idah and Marquinos just hasn't been there. That requires more experience than they have and missed passes or lost balls mean moves break down time after time. Sara is still a key player, but his role has been compromised.

    Sørensen could be another possibility, but Wagner seems to think that more attacking players are the answer. We'll have to wait and see what happens at Blackburn.
     
    #645
  6. Golden Eadie 2

    Golden Eadie 2 Well-Known Member

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    I think, possibly erroneously, that Dowell is the missing link. When he played, good results, no Dowell, carp.
     
    #646
  7. Robbie BB

    Robbie BB Well-Known Member

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    Every player is a link in two chains, the offensive and the defensive chain. Kieran is one of those who strengthens the former while simultaneously weakening latter. That's what holds him back and puts a ceiling on how far he can progress in his career. Irrespective of which, I agree we are missing him now. It will be interesting to see whether he is offered a new contract, and whether he accepts it. (If you want an example of a defensively strong attacking midfielder, you need look no further than Emi Buendia -- remember him? :emoticon-0106-cryin)
     
    #647
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  8. Robbie BB

    Robbie BB Well-Known Member

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  9. Walsh.i.am

    Walsh.i.am Well-Known Member
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  10. zogean_king

    zogean_king Well-Known Member

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    #650

  11. Robbie BB

    Robbie BB Well-Known Member

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    "It’s the same players who got us fifth, fifth, eighth and won the FA Cup - it’s still roughly the same players": Rob Tanner (the Leicester City equivalent of Michael Bailey, writer for The Athletic).
    At least we aren't alone in making that mistake.
     
    #651
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  12. Robbie BB

    Robbie BB Well-Known Member

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  13. Walsh.i.am

    Walsh.i.am Well-Known Member
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    David Wagner has confirmed Grant Hanley will miss the remainder of Norwich City's season.
     
    #653
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  14. RiverEndRick

    RiverEndRick Well-Known Member

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    On a positive note, Abu Kamara achieved a WhoScored rating of 6.9 for his 11 minutes on the pitch against Rotherham:
    Screenshot_20230414-085518.png
     
    #654
  15. GozoCanary

    GozoCanary Well-Known Member

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    I don't want to be negative, but how on earth did he get that? IMO he has really looked overwhelmed in both matches when he came on. And where is Tzolis?
     
    #655
  16. Robbie BB

    Robbie BB Well-Known Member

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    Every player starts with 6.0 and thereafter gains or loses points depending on their involvement in positive or negative "ball events". I think that's how it works anyway. But the ratings depend on WhoScored's "secret" algorithm, which presumably assigns a points value to each player action. Tzolis's rating was 6.0, so either he did nothing, or positive contributions counter-balanced negative ones.
     
    #656
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2023
  17. DUNCAN DONUTS

    DUNCAN DONUTS SOCIAL JUSTICE WARRIOR

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    #657
  18. RiverEndRick

    RiverEndRick Well-Known Member

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    It surprised me as well Gozo, but my impression was that he brought a spark of liveliness when he came on, much like Rowe when he broke through.

    Tzolis, on the other hand, seems to struggle to fit in effectively, but he did score a very good goal earlier. I'd love to see him fit in and kick on, but there hasn't been much evidence of that so far.
     
    #658
  19. GozoCanary

    GozoCanary Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the info. Since Tzolis set up a good chance for Idah and also had a shot cleared off the line in the few minutes he was on the pitch, I can only imagine that the wild shot at the very end was seen as a very clear opportunity which counter-balanced these positive contributions. (In my opinion, camera angles suggest it wasn't.) Still seems rather strange to me, though, that someone who did that should rate much lower than a player who came on and basically did nothing.

    As you know, I can be somewhat technophobic, but some of these rankings do nothing to increase my trust in these quantitative measurements of a player's performance. Any ranking system is only as good as the criteria which are fed into the system. Garbage in, garbage out, as the old saying goes.
     
    #659
  20. GozoCanary

    GozoCanary Well-Known Member

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    I guess one reason there are so many efforts to come up with a good quantitative ranking system is that two people can have such wildly differing views of a player based on the eye test. IMO, Kamara has looked totally out of his depth in his two cameos so far and he isn't ready for the step up. Both Rowe and Springett looked much better to me on their debuts.
     
    #660

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