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Nathan Jones sacked as Saints er....."manager"

Discussion in 'Southampton' started by Osvaldorama, Jan 4, 2023.

  1. tomw24

    tomw24 Well-Known Member
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    With option 2, it really depends on how much Solak watches us and how much input he wants to have in the club. He's the main financial backer at the end of the day so if he wants Jones gone he's gone IMO. What our January spending tells me is that he is becoming more active behind the scenes. He's given Ankersen the money to buy the players to keep us in the PL. I'm speculating here but I don't think he'd be impressed with us scraping survival on the last day or something like that. I think he expects to see a big improvement in the 2nd half of the season and Jones will be the one who gets the blame if it doesn't happen.
     
    #721
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  2. San Tejón

    San Tejón Well-Known Member

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    Much depends on how Jones uses the new players and how he changes the mentality of the rest of the squad to fit in with, for example, a giant leading the front line.
    I touched on this yesterday when I said that if we were now going to start going route one, then the midfielders and wide players have to gamble on Onuachu heading the ball on towards goal and time their runs to get in behind the CBs and into space. Arsenal, when they had Alan Smith up front were really good at this, so I would be expecting JWP and Alcaraz making these runs either side of Onuachu but also with the wide players doing so as well.
    One key thing here, for me, is for the long pass forward to not be so long that the knock on goes straight to the keeper, so maybe target the edge of the centre circle and potentially have plenty of space for runners to get to the ball before the keeper and then miss a 1 on 1 chance.
    Equally, for crosses to the back post, we need to be getting more players gambling on him knocking the ball back across the box, rather than just having one or two players there.
    Playing long would better suit a 4-2-3-1 system, IMO.
     
    #722
  3. Pelletron

    Pelletron Well-Known Member

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    I have a feeling some on here feel Robovac might do a better job of managing Saints! What's its favourite pizza, and is it a vacuum cleaner of faith?!
     
    #723
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  4. thereisonlyoneno7

    thereisonlyoneno7 Well-Known Member

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    Great sweeper too in a back 4....
     
    #724
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  5. StJabbo1

    StJabbo1 Well-Known Member

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    It'd be a good throw of the dyson.
     
    #725
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  6. thereisonlyoneno7

    thereisonlyoneno7 Well-Known Member

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    I was going to mention that, but it is a Anker Vacuum.

    Open goal for someone there.
     
    #726
  7. StJabbo1

    StJabbo1 Well-Known Member

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    As would that Bex Bissell.
     
    #727
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  8. Pelletron

    Pelletron Well-Known Member

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    You have essentially wanted Southampton's manager gone since after Nigel Adkins got sacked (can't recall your specific views on Poch or Koeman, I admit, but am sure you were pining for Adkins through most of Poch's time, and angry with the club for their treatment of Adkins). Despite what I say about the dislike of NJ being driven by a clash with his personality, I do acknowledge it is everyone's right to criticise a manager - he gets paid a ****load of cash in a high profile job, so managers know what they might expect if they don't get results.

    But I can't see how you can genuinely judge him on results against Forest and Brighton, which were essentially his first two PL fixtures ever (not counting Liverpool). He had the same set of players Ralph had, with which he lost who remembers how many matches in a row up to that point. Forget the six weeks NJ had beforehand - that's planning, and can never replace match experience. It's ridiculous to suggest that amounts to anything when it's a brand new team he's never had on a pitch before. Ralph could have been expected to do something with that time, having had seasons with the team and chosen the players, but not NJ. If you don't want to count cup games as relevant, then that is two league games vs opposition (Fulham, Villa) which could always go either way with any team. This doesn't seem enough data to make a call - though I admit I felt the same about Pellegrino almost immediately (though he was coming on the back of some extremely successful managers for us) - and as I've said, imo NJ has something about him.
     
    #728
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  9. Archers Road

    Archers Road Urban Spaceman

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    Would you have taken Sean Dyche

    Not very helpful to me, I think I missed that episode of Star Trek <laugh>
     
    #729
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  10. LincolnSaint

    LincolnSaint Well-Known Member

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    What is it exactly that you think he has achieved since he's been here?

    If results aren't the be all and end all for you what identity do you think he has stamped on the team which show results will come?

    The liklihood of him being sacked/not being sacked should have very little influence on whether we as fans back him, more power to your elbow for support regardless of the circumstances but for a lot of others their patience is wafer thin.

    Every NJ game that I have witnessed first hand we've looked awful. Passing and pressing out the window. His press conferences do not bare relation to what I've watched time and time again. There's nothing there offering any glimmer of getting better or building on results.
     
    #730
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  11. Ian Thumwood

    Ian Thumwood Well-Known Member

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    It is fascinating to see this board start to divide into two camps with Nathan Jones starting to get some kudos which was totally absent in the first few weeks after the return from the World Cup. I have not posted on here for a few weeks as I have to admit I have found following Southampton to be totally depressing and needed to avoid football whilst I had other issues I needed to deal with. For the first time in ages, I have not bothered to attend home matches. I regret that whilst I am pleased with the signings, the home defeats to Brighton, Forest and Villa were sufficienltly dispiriting to make me feel they will ultimately have little difference.

    There were moments in the Newcastle game when it looked like we had upped our game but these moments were fleeting and never produced anything. I have not been to the away matches to gauge if the performances truly reflect the results and therefore can only make a judgement on what I have been watching at St Mary's. I reget to say that I think we have regressed since departing with Ralph. It seemed clear that he had to go yet the appointment of Nathan Jones as a replacement has , in my opinion, overseen a deterioration in our home performances on so many levels. I concur that both Ralph and Jones have suffered through the lack of a decent forward yet, in the case of the latter, it just seems that the defence is less competent, "in form" players like Perraud are dropped and midfield looks even more lightweight. The biggest issue I have with Jones is that he does not learn from his mistakes. There is so much to pick him up on. The five at the back is the obvious criticism but playing people out of position just underscores the perception that he is clueless. His coaching methods seem to have had no effect on either Adams or Armstrong and I feel some of our better players are diminished under his stewardship.

    I love the fact that the board is re-freshing the team yet I strongly believe it they had made these signings for Ralph we would have been mid-table. I would like to have seen Ralph take control of a team that has been re-built to this extent and I am convinced that he would have found it invigorating. If I had known that we had intended to bring Jones in, I would never have wanted him to leave. Ralph always seemed a gent whereas the press conferences and post-match interviews given by Nathan Jones make me wince with embarrassment. Much has been made of the "Southampton Way" and I believe that Jones is the antithesis of this. I am not seeing improvements in performances and am in a constant state of bemusement as to his team selections. This week's statement alluding to he possible departure in the summer of Livramento and KWP is disappointing but after the predicted signing of a full back from Luton, it is pretty obvious that his perception of the game is as equally deluded as Ian Branfoot's. The parallels are uncanny.

    I think that defeats in the next two matches will prove that the appointment of Nathan Jones was a risk too far. It is really difficult for me to see what the positives were with bringing him in. I appreciate that some in here hold a different view and feel obliged to give him a chance. The results have been a massive disappointment and I am struggling to see what positives Nathan Jones is bringing to the club. To my eyes, he seems both deluded and incompetent . I cannot see us getting off the bottom slot with him at the helm. Too many poor decisions are being made for this to happen.
     
    #731
  12. SaintinNZ

    SaintinNZ Well-Known Member

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    If you asking would I have taken Dyche over Jones as the only two options, the answer would be yes, I would. Were either of them my hoped for appointment? **** no.

    I've listened to a couple of podcasts with Dyche and I like the cut of his jib but I've also watched a few years of his Burnley and I don't care much for his football. Seeing what Burnley have become without him, its hard to swallow the line that he was working with what he had. He was working the way he knew.
     
    #732
  13. Archers Road

    Archers Road Urban Spaceman

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    Wouldn’t have to worry about a back 3/5 under Dyche. We’d move straight to a flat back 9.

    Don’t think Everton are happy btw.
     
    #733
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  14. Pelletron

    Pelletron Well-Known Member

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    In my view, because he has been here such a small amount of time - basically, January has been his first proper month - and managed so few games, I don't expect him necessarily to have achieved anything. We have been losing matches by a goal all season anyway, even under Ralph, with the exceptions of Liverpool, City, and Newcastle in the league, who all put 3 or 4 past us. But on the basis of the games I have seen - he's shown we can raise our game to beat the best team in the country; we have definitely had spells of good control in many of our games, including vs Newcastle - even if that comes off the back of poor selections or a poor first 45 minutes of a game; we have taken a massive three points off our nearest rivals for the bottom slot - a match that barely gets a mention, but you know would be the biggest stick of all to beat him with had we lost it. We saw in the World Cup that teams just need to stay in games to have a chance of winning - and I see us staying in games atm - just with no striker or anyone to put away the few chances we are creating, which have often been gilt-edged btw. And I see enough players being galvanised by him to see a positive way forward.

    It might not come, but I believe it will. He clearly states he knows how he wants the team to play - by this, I mean the approach rather than the formation - and attempts at imposing himself on the team rather than letting the team do its own thing around him, as Pellegrino did, for example. He is pro active, and there is some personality there, whether people like it or not.

    And so, I just want to support that, because I support the club, and feel that the fans, team, and club will benefit from moving in the same direction at this early stage of the cycle. Personally, I feel it's too late to try to sort it out if this doesn't work out - another new manager is not going to help anything - so this is what we have to put everything into, like it or not. I'm not sure we will even seen the style play NJ would like to play in an ideal world this season - I personally think this is safety first, and do what it takes to stay up. Which you may laugh at, given how it's working out on the results front so far, but again, new players now, let's see how it works out in the coming games.
     
    #734
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2023
  15. SaintMarv

    SaintMarv Well-Known Member

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    If we had him as manager would we have another 6ft7 striker doing the Robovac. <laugh>
     
    #735
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  16. Brinkworth Saint

    Brinkworth Saint Well-Known Member

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    Must be tough living next to Liverpool's domination. But afraid no sympathy from me.
     
    #736
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  17. - Doing The Lambert Walk

    - Doing The Lambert Walk Well-Known Member

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    DCC sitting in the B team while Lyanco is guaranteed to start - again. Get this man out of the club before it's too late. <doh>

     
    #737
  18. SaintMarv

    SaintMarv Well-Known Member

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    Looking at that line up perhaps it's about game time and fitness levels.
     
    #738
  19. SaintsFan86

    SaintsFan86 Well-Known Member

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    I mean it doesn't hugely bother me that DCC plays, probably lacking sharpness.
    I'll lose my **** however if we persist with 3 atb.
     
    #739
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  20. RSS

    RSS Well-Known Member

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    DCC was playing regularly until the red in the first leg which was just over a week ago.
     
    #740

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