I take your point, but we already knew it was possible. As you say, Poch had us up there not so long ago. With a little more good investment at the right time, we might have gone all the way. Time will tell if this iteration of Arsenal will. But I definitely think our funk is made worse by the fact it’s that lot at the top of the league, playing good football and largely doing things the right way, while we were there a few years ago, didn’t get a trophy over the line, and now look like we’re going in circles with no clear plan.
Levy getting what Levy deserves and we suffer as a consequence When you sign someone like Conte…you back him or you don’t sign him… nothing personal against the likes of Spence, prolly Bissouma too but maybe he didn’t want them and I guess he’s in the business of getting the players he wants so that he can do his work, or he uses what’s already at the club…but I don’t think top managers wait for clueless chairmen to buy whoever they think might, just might turn out good and then kerching, business, profit, maybe some football for us to watch too. if I was a top gaffer I wouldn’t play the owners choice either, why should I? Was that the deal? I doubt it. So no blame on me for Conte for his selections…he doesn’t want to set that precedent with the owners…you cant expect an elite manager to pander to a clueless chairman Next time sign a yes man you ****ing idiot Mauricio ‘a new house needs new furniture but I’ll probably get sacked instead’ Pochetino is a mug if he comes back to work for Levy.
On one hand: we all noticed the improvement that the two Juve players made when they arrived last January. It is therefore (should be?) unsurprising that without them we are no better than we were when they arrived. Get them back in the team and we might have a chance at the same sort of run that happened from last Jan, plus we are a few points ahead of where we were then. Not only that, can we even argue that we held a good Brenford team? I mean many were disappointed to draw with them, and we nearly won, but Brentford have now stuffed Pool, who some think are better than us. But on the other hand: as some might recall I am (one of) the last to criticise this club. I often come on here after a bad performance and try to add some perspective. And you know what? I'm pretty much fed up with it all. Fed up with not winning? No. Fed up with the lack of attacking, fed up with the lack of trying, and *most of all* fed up with surrendering the initiative to the other team. That's not Spurs, but more than that it's not sensible. It's harder for the other team to score if you are attacking them, and it's easier to win a game if you aren't conceding the first goal every game. But you know what, most of all it's more *entertaining*. And that's what leads to a better experience for me. There were many games under Poch where we dominated but didn't win. People say things like 'possession doesn't count, goals count'. Well not for me. Being in control of the game and trying to score, plus putting the required effort in to do so is what I want. Results are important but how you get them is equally important. Others say that 'you'd take 1-0 wins if you won a cup' or as an extension of that 'you wouldn't mind if your player dived to get a pen to win the game' and the answer is no. Seriously. I don't want diving to win pens, I don't want boring football to win 1-0, I don't want a dodgy middle eastern state to buy the club even if it meant unlimited funds. I want entertaining front foot football. Is that impossible, even if we don't sign any new players?
I don't agree with your first point. Let's not forget that after Conte's arrival but before Kulu and Bentancur joined, we went on a 9 game unbeaten run that included that phenomenal performance against Liverpool and that incredible win at Leicester. Even without last Jan's signings, we are significantly better than we were then. Our defence for that Liverpool game was Sanchez-Dier-Davies with Royal and Sess at wingback and a midfield of Dele-Winks-Ndombele!! Against Leicester, Dier and Son were injured so we started with Tanganga in defense and Lucas up front!! It literally beggars belief how suddenly and how rapidly we seem to be regressing to a point beyond the time you're describing. The passion, the fight, the energy we saw when he first took over that seeped through to the players so that even a ragtag bunch of misfits could go on a 9 game unbeaten run is totally absent now. Conte cuts a forlorn, tired figure on the touchline most games but I am afraid his frustration is almost entirely of his own making. I cannot see how people can look at the evidence in front of their eyes and still come to the conclusion that the problem is Daniel Levy. It was all the way up until Nov 2021. Then he took a huge step back and allowed Paratici to run the footballing show (Nuno was a Levy appointment I'm convinced of it, and hopefully the last significant sporting decision he makes) - something we'd all been crying out for since we started building the new stadium. The only mitigation in Conte's favour is that we have been really unlucky with injuries this season - I'll give him that. But the rest? Totally on him.
That`s a load of horse shiete, true and real fans would support the club no matter what, they may not like it, but they would not be able to just stop following. I don`t like the current ownership, and want rid of them, but I still follow the club and always will do no matter who takes over. Taking the moral high ground when people do not like a certain type of owner, even though the current mob are not exactly squeaky clean, smacks of hypocrisy.
There’s a considerable amount of irony in this post considering you’ve been advocating boycotting games and not buying Spurs merch because you don’t like the current ownership but are telling someone they’re wrong if they choose to not support the club if a possible murderous dictator or oligarch took charge…
****ing hell, Football BSider knows which side their bread is buttered now that they're giving rent-a-gob comments slagging off Lenglet as "the cheap option"...
Agreed. Otherwise it's just an argument for never drawing the line. In that context pretty much every decision we make is compromised because of grey areas. If that was the case you could never take a stand on anything. You've got to live up to your own level of hypocrisy and mine tells me that getting taken over by a dodgy state is a step too far... for me. And I would walk away. Because (for me) it wouldn't be the same club any more.
I probably wouldn't walk away, even if I was unhappy about the morality of the potential new owner because I've spent all my life supporting Spurs and I don't think I could just switch off that support or switch allegiance to another club but I'd definitely understand the decision of those who did choose to be done with the club because there are people with far better and stronger morals than myself. I'd definitely feel less connected though if we went down the corrupt ownership route. And assuming the eventual winning of trophies and titles followed, that would feel nowhere near as special, the first one or two definitely would be cause celebration but I see how City and Chelsea fans celebrate nowadays and there's definitely a more mellowed cheer to it, I'd hate to be in a situation where winning things didn't feel that special, I was at Wembley when we last won the League Cup and it was magic, the thought of that feeling deteriorating into the feeling of what it's basically like to win a home game against a relegation candidate isn't appealing in the slightest.
I'm aware none of you really care about my view as a Gooner, but this is my perspective. There's a whole cluster of issues - some of which are the players, some of which are Conte and some of which stem from higher above him. As with many things, you can't point the blame at solely one area to explain your struggles this campaign. Conte did very well to take you from the dark abyss and toxicity under Nuno (who, again, inherited some pre-existing problems) and into the top-4. The signings of Kulusevski and Bentancur aided that surge in form, but he also strengthened morale, marshalled the defence, improved your average distance covered per match and got a tune out of several underperforming players. Your performances at The Etihad and Anfield were testament to this. So within his initial 6-7 months, despite early exits from the cups, he had an unquestionably transformative effect on your form which culminated in a Champions League spot. This season, he's been wedded to a system that looks totally dysfunctional without a couple of inclusions (namely Kulusevski), he doesn't rotate enough even when he has options available to him, his loyalty to certain individuals is baffling, he's not shown much tactical flexibility/adaptability, he's not proactive enough in responding to differing game-states and he's not been able to find a solution to your frequent slow starts to matches. Fans after the Aston Villa game were protesting against ENIC/Levy for not financially backing the managers, and whilst I understand the frustrations, I do think this is misguided, as he was supported in the last window. Adding Forster, Perisic, Bissouma, Richarlison, Spence, Lenglet, as well as re-signing Kulusevski and Romero, (with Udogie as a future signing), to a team that finished 4th last season, the drop-off in collective and individual displays shouldn't be this vast. And whilst not all of those players were Conte's signings, for someone getting paid £15m a year, he needs to be getting more out of what he has at his disposal. So Conte has to take responsibility for this. And his shirking of responsibility in post-match interviews and press conferences is a big issue. What you can blame ENIC/Levy for is their appointments. The mish-mash of different managers that don't align with the club's ethos. If you are going to bring in managers like Mourinho and Conte, they need to have almost total control over transfers and will demand to be backed to the hilt. They will not be interested in developing youth or developing a progressive, attacking brand of football on a consistent basis. Managers like this want the players they want so they can win as soon as possible with a ready-made squad. You can't appoint someone like this and support them half-heartedly (with respect to the players they want; Conte wanted some of those players, but not all of them) because there will still be a clash of values. From a purely results perspective, I don't think you've done that bad. In spite of your troubles, you're still in a top-4 race, you qualified top of your CL group and FA Cup hasn't started yet, so that remains to be seen. But I do think a lot of the fans' frustrations have been exacerbated by the fact Arsenal are top of the league currently, whilst playing an attractive style. Fundamentally, I think Brian said it right the other day - that Spurs need to decide what type of club they're going to be. If they want to appoint managers like Conte, their modus operandi has to change. These managers need full buy-in for short-term gains. But if they want to be a club that develops youth, plays attractive football and incrementally builds their way to challenging on all fronts, they need to hire a manager that fits that profile and support him as necessary. Currently, it seems like the Spurs' hierarchy are caught between two worlds and aren't getting the best from either.
Not sure why but after the last few days I’ve got a bit of optimism back. Looking at the teams around us, Chelsea and Liverpool look as poor as we do. United have had a fortunate run of fixtures and I still think Newcastle will drop off so still 3rd and 4th up for grabs. sure it will evaporate again if we don’t get the win tomorrow but I can’t see why we can’t get 4th and if the draw falls right, have a real go at the fa cup. Either way though, I can’t see conte here next season even if both/one of those things happen. We’re not the right club for him and he’s not the right manager for how we want to work. onwards and upwards.
There’s levels to it, obviously. No billionaire is squeaky clean and the info about Lewis’s activities in Argentina has resurfaced again the last couple of days. For me the idea of being owned by a SWF (like PIF/Newcastle) is more objectionable because of what the club becomes and the soft power play it then represents. The same is true of a shadily-connected foreign oligarch like Abramovic. The question of ENIC Out is hugely complicated by the fact that we have no idea who would take over. It’s not like changing a manager or players because it’s impossible to propose new owners. Every Spurs fan would like a billionaire fan owner who made their money ethically and would pump money into the club and make every correct decision. That’s not even up for debate. But that individual does not exist. All I can judge the question of ENIC in or out by, myself, is by looking at the other owners out there for the big clubs in the PL. They’re mostly not individuals or organisations I would feel comfortable having as owners. We have to ask ourselves why we support Spurs. That’s a different question to what we want out of it. We all want success for the club and trophies won and an entertaining style of football. But I think a great many fans also stay attached to Spurs because, rightly or wrongly, they attach certain values to the club. The same is true of other clubs, like Liverpool for example, even if the outside picture is different to the image the fans have of the institution. Spurs would not be the same to me if they were bought by another PIF, ADUG, or whoever. They also wouldn’t have been the same club if the ESL had gone through and Spurs had been a founding member and in doing so, abandoned the English football system that is such an integral part of the footballing ethos and culture of the country. We should absolutely call out ENIC and Levy for the poor decisions they have made but what’s also important to me is that the club is built to be self-sustaining and are trying to do things the right way. We are not financially doped. Thanks to the infrastructure built under ENIC the club will likely be a wealthy one in 100 years time no matter who owns it. We do sorely lack a defined footballing vision and some of the actions of the owners the last few years have been baffling. But ultimately the club is one that I have few qualms about supporting whole heartedly and passionately and I couldn’t say that if we were bought out by an owner I didn’t feel comfortable with, or had joined the ESL. I don’t know for sure if I would ditch the club if those things happened because it’s such a huge part of my life, but it wouldn’t have felt the same to support it.
New Year’s resolution. Try to be a bit more balanced and reflective rather than all or nothing (especially when the nothing is straight after a game when I’ve had a few!)
One game a week that was the key to our success in the run in last year, our form up to the end of the Jan last season was win a game/lose a game including losing at Burnley having won at City - This season has been a greater slog than any before and Conte is unable to to do his preparation as thoroughly as he would like and as a result we are suffering.
Which says a lot about his squad management If his requirements are too much for the same eleven players to do twice a week, then clearly some players need to be switched in and out if we're playing twice a week - which also means that, if somebody is injured or suspended, the player coming in for them is reasonably up to speed, for example while it's reasonable to assume Hojbjerg could play twice a week if needs be but it's obvious that Perisic can't That's why Conte's comment about needing 15 or 16 top quality players to have a competitive squad is drawing quite a bit of comment of late, because at present there's reason to believe that four or five of those players would be getting as much time on the pitch as Skipp or Bissouma are getting right now
No, it doesn't. Not even remotely. You're attempting to compare your standard rich ****er with actual dictators. Newcastle's ultimate owner had a journalist dismembered, FFS. The suggestion that I'm not a true and real fan because I don't want to be associated with that is laughable. I would be unhappy if we got into a Chelsea-style situation and started outspending everyone else massively. If that was due to a murderous criminal owning the club, then I'd be out. I've said the same for years.
I'd stop supporting us immediately. Football isn't a religion. It isn't about blind obedience. As a sport, it is first and foremost about bringing people together and in an enjoyable and entertaining way. If it came to pass that we fell under the ownership of an individual or group who through their actions spread discord and disunity among people and through their money kill fair competition and therefore enjoyment, I don't see the point in persisting to be honest.
