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Off Topic Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Southampton' started by ChilcoSaint, Feb 23, 2016.

  1. ChilcoSaint

    ChilcoSaint What a disgrace
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  2. saintrichie123

    saintrichie123 Well-Known Member

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  3. saintrichie123

    saintrichie123 Well-Known Member

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  4. Osvaldorama

    Osvaldorama Well-Known Member

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    Some good has come of Liz Truss’ appointment then
     
    #35864
  5. San Tejón

    San Tejón Well-Known Member

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  6. Schad

    Schad Well-Known Member

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    Again, though, you're giving Russia an excuse that Russia itself isn't giving. Their explicit, stated rationale is not NATO encroachment; it's that Ukraine doesn't exist.

    The notion that a belligerent Russia, which has already invaded multiple other neighbours and either seized territory directly or set up client states, would have somehow been dissuaded from doing so if only people left them alone, simply has nothing to support it.
     
    #35866
  7. Ian Thumwood

    Ian Thumwood Well-Known Member

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    There are some brilliant arguments being put fr both sides in this debate regarding the Russia / Ukraine ware. I think that it is both appalling as well as being fascinating. Both Russia and the West have got this totally wrong, in my opinion. It is a very good point regarding why the EU never invited Russia to join. I have often wondered myself albeit I think that Russia would have wanted to have been a dominant party and would not necessarily been someone who could have be trusted to obey the rules. I say this is a good point as I feel that the conflict has a lot to do with the EU picking off various parts of the USSR and the perceived weakening of the politcal position of Russia, This has been a driving force behind Russia's invasion

    The other point I feel that needs to be made is that I think it really suits NATO to have this proxi-conflict. It has really shown the Russian military forces to be imcompetent and demonstrated that the Russians would be incapable of mounting any "traditional" warfare against the West of Europe. The ony problem is that Russia now realizes that the only war it has of winning a conventional war is to use nuclear wreapons. I cannot see that happening for political and technological reasons. You do wonder just how far the malaise perpetuates throughout all forms of the Russian military. I can see this conflict being studied by historians for years to come as defining the point when armoured vehicles were rendered obsolete as well as a lesson in how not to use logistics. Playing devil's advocate, I would argue that , prior to Ukraine, a beligerent Russia would ultimately be appeased once it has captured Modlova and the Baltic states as well as rendering Poland neutral. I don't think that Putin's objectives would ever had stretched beyond the borders of the old USSR. Previously I was dead against getting involved in the conflict and felt that both NATO and the EU had a degree of responsibility in provoking Putin. Six month down the line, I do not think anyone could have anticipated the conflict still going on and Western Europe's economies trashed. In the long run I agree with the fact that aiding Ukraine has assisted as a deterent and that the conflict has demonstrated that this is no longer the way to fight a conflict. Russia's military status has been seriously questionned and I concur to a degree that this may influence the Chinese who similarly have not been tested by a sophisticated , Western coalition. In the long term, this will cause a massive problem for Ukraine and, for different reasons, a major dent in Russia's perceived military might. As far as the West is concerned, there will be a short term crisis in the coming 12-18 months yet I feel that it will ultimately prompt innovation to look away from using fossil fuels. Ultimately the Russians will deal with Putin themselves although the events of the last six months are demonstrative that it is incapable of become a modern democracy. I agree that the defeat of Russia will make China think twice about invading Taiwan and you wonder how the fact that Russia has bought a lot of it's stock such as the inferior Chinese tyres will make this nation reflect on the quality of it's own hardware.​
     
    #35867
  8. saintrichie123

    saintrichie123 Well-Known Member

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  9. saintrichie123

    saintrichie123 Well-Known Member

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    Scary ………..
    D24C0D60-4468-408F-B7E7-9099A9AD5AB6.jpeg
     
    #35869
    ChilcoSaint likes this.
  10. - Doing The Lambert Walk

    - Doing The Lambert Walk Well-Known Member

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    Until they put Suella Braverman in the Home Office, and then it actually gets worse (incredibly!).
     
    #35870

  11. ChilcoSaint

    ChilcoSaint What a disgrace
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  12. - Doing The Lambert Walk

    - Doing The Lambert Walk Well-Known Member

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  13. Ian Thumwood

    Ian Thumwood Well-Known Member

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    She won't be in control for long. She will be out by Christmas!
     
    #35873
  14. Le Tissier's Laces

    Le Tissier's Laces Well-Known Member

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    I admire your optimism, Ian!
     
    #35874
  15. - Doing The Lambert Walk

    - Doing The Lambert Walk Well-Known Member

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  16. Le Tissier's Laces

    Le Tissier's Laces Well-Known Member

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    Nadine Dorries has gone. This is a very, very, very, very good thing. They could replace her with a turnip, and it would be more effective.
     
    #35876
    StJabbo1 and San Tejón like this.
  17. - Doing The Lambert Walk

    - Doing The Lambert Walk Well-Known Member

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    The epitome of screeching, drunk mad cat woman who lives in the attic.
     
    #35877
    Le Tissier's Laces likes this.
  18. Shandy_top_89

    Shandy_top_89 Well-Known Member

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    It’s interesting that they are choosing to quit, as opposed to just waiting for Truss to name the new cabinet, that isn’t normal is it?
     
    #35878
  19. ChilcoSaint

    ChilcoSaint What a disgrace
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    If you missed the victory speech earlier, here it is in full:
     
    #35879
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  20. - Doing The Lambert Walk

    - Doing The Lambert Walk Well-Known Member

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    Talk that she's stepping aside to focus on her career as an author (yes, really) and prepare to be put in the House of Lords (yes, really really).
     
    #35880

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