The narrow pitch at stoke - QPR all over again?

Let's remember that even Manchester United, Chelsea, Liverpool and so many more haven't won at stoke. It will be a tough game. I think we have to play a high line and try and play the offside trap. Their strength is the long ball, so the deeper we are, the easier it is for them to play and get flick-ons. If we put pressure on the player before the long ball, it should lead to more inaccurate kicks. That's why we should play 4-3-3.

Krul
Santon Taylor Colo Raylor
Tiote
Cabaye Guthrie
Obertan Ba Jonas

We can't play Ben Arfa as Stoke are a compact team. There will be very little space in between the defence and midfield for Benny to work. Bring him on as sub when there will be more space.

 

It has to be a 4-5-1. I know Stoke's midfield isn't great (especially their CMs) but we need more men in midfield to get full control, especially when we're away at the Britannia and the fans are behind them.

Let's get men in the midfield and get our short passing game going. Imo it's the best tactic against Stoke as we won't be playing into their hands with the long balls and the physical tussling. If the players can keep the passes going before they get steamrollered from behind by a Stoke giant then we should retain good possession.

 

By that logic I should start, based on my 0 poor performances for Newcastle United.

Cup games are the chance for fringe players to stake a claim, and from what I heard on the radio despite a reasonably tidy game he gave little cover to his fullback, something that Obertan does do. I'd still like to give him a go, but I won't be all over Pardew if he doesn't.

 

QPRs pitch is smallest in the league. Stoke, second smallest - it doesnt have to be, they make it that way for their long throw ins.

Personally i dont think it should be allowed. Stoke had to widen their pitch in the UEFA cup as it didnt not comply with UEFA rules. All pitches should be the same size IMO. Stokes pitch is anti-football as it stiffles wing play which often produces the more entertaining aspects of the game.

 

QPR's is smaller and Shaun Wright-Phillips tore Ryan Taylor a new one on the wing. All info I can find shows Stokes is only smaller than the biggest by about 7 yards, and usually the difference is only due to the actual space available. Yes, Stoke do it for the throwins, but they're not exactly gaining 20 yards.

 

It's quite amazing how much difference 7 yards makes. That could be 2/3 metres of less space a winger would otherwise have.

 

So in that respect

Should the half time watering of pitches in favour of which end the home team is attacking be banned?

It stifles wing play?

We play (normally ) with 2 out & out wingers at home, so how does a smaller pitch stifle wing play?

 

No. But if your winger is ****e and plays badly all season, then surely you drop him in favour of the winger that has played well in 80% of his admittedly limited appearances?

 

SWP is only about 5foot and can opporate in smaller spaces. My point isnt that though, fact is the more space the more entertaining football is (generally). By narrowing the pitch Stoke are making an advantage to their players. Most teams use the wings but Stoke are (still) built up for long balls and rely less on wingers. And theres those long throws of course. Nothing wrong with any of that, they can play how they want. But they shouldnt be allowed to alter the pitch to accomodate it.

Its not a level playing field (scuse the pun) and it shouldnt be allowed.

 

a) Yes. It should be banned.

b) Your wingers play on that every other week and are used to it.

 

Given that we're comparing Premier League fixtures to games against lower league opposition in the cup I'd leave it to the managers discretion. I'm not remotely an Obertan fan, but you're effectively advocating starting Lovenkrands over Best after his last few games.

Not even remotely a fact. Quality players such as Cabaye and Tiote should be able to boss a tighter midfield even more than usual, ever watched a competitive Futsal game? Or those Zidane indoor videos? Good players can operate in small spaces, if anything a big pitch favours crap kick and run tactics.

 

What is 1 of the biggest playing surfaces in the UK?

Wembley

If we really need a bigger pitch to play on, then i will remind you of the FA Cup semi-final result last year v Bolton

Bolton 0 Stoke City 5

 

Disagree with with a lot of what's been said on here, we need HBA to play down the middle and provide some trickery & magic in the middle of the park, he can go past big lumping Stoke CB's and either draw the foul or get past and shoot, he is exactly what we need against Stoke who will stop anything coming from the wings by sheer size & height of their CB's, beating them will take guile and quick passing as Le Arse showed last week. (not sure I'd even play Ba as he'll win nothing in the air)

 

But even in his appearances in the league from the bench he has done more than Obertan.

As for Best, he needs a kick up the backside, but while Marv is an unknown in the league apart from a few sub appearances, Loven is proven to be past it at this level so wouldn't be my preferred choice.

 

This is why the narrow pitch favours Stoke:

1). The Stoke players are in a narrower area due to the narrower pitch, so it's easier to find a Stoke player with long balls. There's a shorter arc in which to aim and there's more condensed players.

2). Obviously, there's the shorter throw-ins. Delap doesn't have to push harder to make up those area 2/3 metres on a larger pitch, so he can be more precise.

3). Free kicks. The physical limitation means that any free kicks, even right on the edge of the pitch, will always be much closer to the box.

4). Wing play. Stoke don't rely on their wingers as much as other teams due to their long ball play, whereas opposition teams which involve a lot of wingplay will feel added pressure due to the lack of width. They struggle to move outwards to find some space and eventually meet the line 2/3 metres before they normally would on a different pitch.

 

Ok then how about this -

------------------Ba---------------------

Jonas-----------Ben Arfa-----------Marveaux

------Tiote----------------Cabaye----------

Raylor-------Colo-------Taylor---------Santon

------------------Krul------------------------

I don't like a flat midfield really. I'd prefer it if we player Cabaye and Tiote as defensive mids, and played 3 attacking mids behind Ba.

 

Was going to say exactly this. We need to create space and them two cutting in all the time onto their stronger foot isn't going to help us at all. I'd go

Ba

Marv Cabaye Guthrie Jonas

Tiote

Santon Colo Saylor Raylor/Simpson

Krul

We need to take control of the midfield and I see this as the best way to do it. Cabaye and Guthrie can spray the ball around with Tiote clearing up any danger. Allows Cabaye freedom to move in behind Ba when attacking - it's worked well when them two have linked up this season, most notably against Aston Villa (although we were playing 442 that day). Guthrie was very good in midweek so I'd be inclined to give him a chance.

I'm glad I'm not in AP's shoes though, hard one to approach.

 

1). Jonas and Marveaux are not 'attacking mids'. They're wingers. With your setup you would essentially have one CM player in Ben Arfa, whilst Cabaye is wasted in defensive midfield duties, for some reason.

2). Weren't you at the Blackburn game? It seemed clear to me that Marveaux isn't good on the right. He kept cutting in.



For now, I'd personally play:

---------------Ba---------------------
-------------Ben Arfa-----------------
Jonas --- Tiote --- Cabaye --- Obertan
Raylor --- Colo --- Saylor --- Santon
---------------Krul-----------------


Don't put the wingers too far forward, and allow Ben Arfa, Tiote and Cabaye to work as a CM trio. Also, whilst I think Marveaux is a better player, Obertan is more suited to the right wing, and can provide a lot of pace which Stoke will find difficult. Let's just hope that he has a good day.

PS: I'd also prefer Marveaux on the left and Jonas on the right, but this doesn't ever seem to enter Pardew's mind, so with the chances of it happening so bloody minuscule, I don't see much point in mentioning it.

 

Absolute pisser, for those of you who think we do not rely on wing play at the brit, you are either deluded or have never watched us.

We play 4 at the back, with our 2 C/M just standing infront of the defense, they ARE NOT ALLOWED to get forward, every ball is either lumped (hoofed) up to our big men, hoping to get a flick on, foul, throw in or corner, or played out to the wing to finally get a cross into the box for our big men too attack.

We have no CM capable of holding onto the ball for more than 2-3 passes, thats why we lump it up.

If you play 4-5-1, you will control our midfield & dominate possession, it is then up to you if you can create some chances, but more importantly put those chances away.

Hope it's a cracker

 

1. Yep, but only percentage balls. In a narrow area its hard to find space so all they can do is welly it at Crouch and hope for the best, we've got Ba, potentially Best and Obertan who can do exactly the same. If our defense is working well we can cope with it.

2. Yes, thats why they've done it, but given that Delap can hit the penalty area from near enough the half way line I don't think 2-3 metres bothers him. He's got plenty of assists with them away from home.

3. Freekicks will be taken where the foul takes place, its our own daft fault if we commit them near the area. If they supposedly aren't using wingers surely this is more of an advantage for us where Jonas and Obertan can win free kicks if different areas?

4. See above I guess. Jonas uses tricks more than pace anyway, its not as if he goes really wide with pace, he goes through players most of the time.

I'm not disputing they've set it up to their advantage, I'm just disputing that its unfair (its not) and that if we lose its becase we can't cope with the pitch rather than not being able to cope with a good Stoke team. Theres no reason why our players can't deal with a marginally smaller playing area.

As far as formations go I'll agree with Tash, though I'm still inclined to start Ba and Best. Ba comes short anyway and we can flood the midfield with players with good feet, even our more defensive midfielders are technically decent. Ben Arfa off the bench to impact the second half.