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Grand Prix thread ABU DHABI GRAND PRIX 2021

Discussion in 'Formula 1' started by ched999uk, Dec 7, 2021.

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Who will win - simple :-) ?

Poll closed Dec 10, 2021.
  1. Lewis Hamilton

    71.4%
  2. Max Verstappen

    7.1%
  3. Valtteri Bottas

    7.1%
  4. Sergio Perez

    7.1%
  5. Lando Norris

    7.1%
  6. Esteban Ocon

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  7. Pierre Gasly

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. Fernando Alonso

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  9. Kimi Raikkonen

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  10. Any Other

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Le Tissier's Laces

    Le Tissier's Laces Well-Known Member

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    To be honest, why on earth didn't he just leave the five lapped cars there. I actually think Max would likely have got him anyway by the end of the lap, and we wouldn't have had this fuss. So stupid.
     
    #641
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  2. Le Tissier's Laces

    Le Tissier's Laces Well-Known Member

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    #642
    ched999uk likes this.
  3. Prince Knut

    Prince Knut GC Thread Terminator

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    Formula Netflix Clown Cars
     
    #643
  4. ched999uk

    ched999uk Well-Known Member

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    Hindsight!
    To me, Masi made a decision that was using guidance he had previously received from Liberty to 'try at all costs to make it entertaining and let them race if it's safe'.
    He should have had 2 choices:
    1. let all lapped cars unlap themselves then on the next lap safety car goes in but that would have been just before the finish line on last lap.
    2. Kept the safety car out till chequered flag.
    Neither of those would enable any more 'racing laps' so wouldn't be good entertainment!!!

    I think Liberty have had way too much influence over Masi. I thought Bernie persuaded FIA that there was a conflict of interest between FIA and media so they split the 2 so there would be no conflict!!! I'm not saying that that split actually removed the conflict but it was supposed to!!

    Thinking about it 1 man made a decision on how the rules applied that the teams never thought was a possibility, so had no strategy to deal with it!
    If rules are allowed to be interpreted that way then how can teams race against moving targets? i.e. was 86mm rear wing gap allowed this race or is it the standard 85mm gap - FIA will decide during the race but it could be 90mm minimum!!!!
     
    #644
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  5. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    Feels worse the day after. I'm actually questioning what the point of watching is going forward is. I know I will, but I feel the sport has really let it's self down. It's a disgrace.
     
    #645
  6. Le Tissier's Laces

    Le Tissier's Laces Well-Known Member

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    Treat yourself to Mansell's Tipo. You'll be grand (and you'll be back in March!)
     
    #646
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  7. moreinjuredthanowen

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    however you can equally say that had this safety car incident happened 1/2 laps earlier or later then this is a non issue. the marshalls have rushed to clear the car, sand down the oil/extingusher **** on track and rushed to get the thing done.

    Massi has thrown the safety car in message out and horner has whinged. If there was 10-15 seconds more all cars would have passed. As it was vettel barely got by before the car was in. HOWEVER if the last 3 had been told to go they surely would have got by verstappen at least.

    So theres an element of disastrous timing here where one lap made all the difference. in theory had masi told the safety car to go through the pits at 60kmph he could have bought himself time to fix the entire thing the way he wanted to.

    Importantly safety was adhered to. after that its a cluster. hamilton was dead meat the minute the safety car was pulled in but if there was 2 laps not 1 then its a slam dunk and if it had 1 lap less then it ends under safety car pulling in and hamilton crossing line under green as winner.

    The issue for me is still at this point the presence of 3 lapped cars between the rest of field and verstappen.
     
    #647
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  8. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    #648
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  9. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    I feel bit sorry for Masi tbh, it's been clear for a while he wasn't up to the task,
    yeah, this has Liberty Media all over it.
     
    #649
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  10. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    I will be back... Been following this crap for too long to give up now. Probably going to just feel a little different about it from now on
     
    #650

  11. Le Tissier's Laces

    Le Tissier's Laces Well-Known Member

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    A little light relief…


    8C52A5E2-5800-4E32-B09D-0E437D61408A.jpeg
     
    #651
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  12. DHCanary

    DHCanary Very Well-Known Member
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    Interesting comment from Masi from the Eifel GP in 2020, in response to complaints that the Safety car took too long: "There is a requirement in the sporting regulations to pass ALL lapped cars." This is in complete contradiction to yesterday's interpretation. I think his comment about a "long standing desire to finish racing under green flag conditions" could also use some qualifying. It's not unheard of for the safety car to enter the pits on the final lap and allow the cars to take the flag without the safety car in front of them. Didn't Schumacher try and get clever under those circumstances way back in 2011 ish? That would have been the precedented protocol here. It's quite a stretch to go from "desire to finish under green flag" to "the rulebook is secondary to this long-standing desire." Curious what conversation were had around this and when.

    The lights were off before Turn 9:

    Assuming the radio is in sync, the safety car in call must have been made seconds after.

    Can you imagine how screwed F1 are if anyone walks over this?
    -Hamilton calls it all a farce and leaves, they've lost a global icon and the best ambassador the sport has ever had. I'd love to see him in Indycar.
    -Merc can pull out without pulling their F1 team out. Their funding contribution isn't that significant. Pull the name, rebrand the team as "Ineos F1", and declare that the team must be bought by the end of the Concorde period (ends 2025) or it'll cease racing.
    -Merc have an agreement to provide engines, but you can't compel them to develop it. Pull all funding from the program and make the 2021 engine to order and do nothing more. Mercedes, McLaren, Aston Martin, Williams - four iconic brands/teams - are reduced to racing at the back of the grid and it's unlikely another engine manufacturer can spin up production sufficiently to take on the other teams. Red Bull win the Championship for the next decade unless Ferrari get their act together. Merc can take F1 back to the snooze-fest of Ferrari domination of the early 2000s.


    Sounds like Mercedes might walk back from their protest today/tomorrow. I suspect that's because they don't see the result of the championship being overturned, and it gives them political capital to negotiate with the FIA for what they really want - Masi out and greater clarity and transparency in F1 governance.
     
    #652
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  13. BrightLampShade

    BrightLampShade Well-Known Member
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    As odd as it seems I will lose respect for Mercedes if they now pull their appeal. Sometimes you have to do what's right, even if you know it'll cause you hassle. The FIA won't willingly have a clear out, someones going to have to take the plunge and make them. I'm half hoping they're trying to get Ferrari involved behind the scenes, that would really turn the screw.
     
    #653
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  14. ched999uk

    ched999uk Well-Known Member

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    Just watched a YouTube vid from Sky and Crofty of all people!
    He makes an interesting point. He basically said if Masi had red flagged the race with 5 laps to go Lewis and Max would both get new Softs and a standing start to battle for the last 5 laps. At least that would have been a proper race to the final flag. Starting at 4:10 as that's when red flag scenario is discussed.

    Sorry if you can't see the vid.
     
    #654
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  15. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    I read somewhere that Merc are going to withdraw their Appeal , but it’s at the request of Lewis .
     
    #655
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  16. Justjazz

    Justjazz Well-Known Member

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    A CAS ruling is legally binding on both parties. I say this assuming it is a recognised arbitrator within the contract the sport has with teams. It will be a big embarrassment for the sport if Mercedes win but I do think this season has been poorly managed from several aspects, Consistency, the cynical Belguim parade behind the safety car, the lobbying. I hope Mercedes go to arbitration as some clarity is needed. While only one race is in question, IF they win Liberty will have to consider how races are managed in future.
     
    #656
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  17. Justjazz

    Justjazz Well-Known Member

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    Wow, I can understand that. Lewis doesn't want to become a figure of hate, which would be a possible outcome.
     
    #657
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  18. ched999uk

    ched999uk Well-Known Member

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    True but somehow the rules need to be clarified so everyone knows the procedures and can work with them.
    I'm not sure how Merc can bring pressure on FIA to sort the issues out for the future. Maybe the new president will have some answers?
     
    #658
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  19. Justjazz

    Justjazz Well-Known Member

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    All valid and maybe the negotiation is Mercedes drop the case IF the FIA clean up the decision making for next year. I have only considered the fairness but if Lewis is instrumental in stopping this it will speak volumes for his Legacy, he in fact would be an even greater champ for it. If this is the case I see his logic, try and put the record straight with a superb season next year, although no guarantees of a Merc domination next year. There is a lot of driver change next year and possible resurgence at Ferrari and maybe McLaren.
     
    #659
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  20. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    I think I saw it on the daily express on line , but can’t find it now .
     
    #660

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