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Off Topic The Chinese Virus

Discussion in 'Newcastle United' started by Albert's Chip Shop, May 3, 2020.

  1. Albert's Chip Shop

    Albert's Chip Shop Top Grafter
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    So you think China have done anything wrong in the whole Covid affair?

    Australia and the US are starting to make noises about reparations and are indicating they believe the Virus originated in a Chinese lab....
     
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  2. Blacker-than-Knight

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    It wouldn't be too much of a surprise to find that the virus was manipulated in a lab rather than a natural mutation, Russia and China are doing exactly the same as the West it's just their safety standards are usually poor, mainly because of secrecy and control issues, think Chernobyl, the regimes also have an ingrained habit of lying when it goes wrong. I'm not saying that the West doesn't do cover ups but the extent to which these regimes goes far outweighs anything the West does.
     
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  3. GeordieHalfbreed

    GeordieHalfbreed Well-Known Member

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    It wasn’t created in a lab. Every intelligence agency and scientist is adamant about that. including those with zero reason to support China.

    Anyone who thinks that the virus naturally arose but then escaped from a lab where it was being studied is assuming that it arose naturally, made the transition to humans (probably at a market). Was identified, isolated, and eliminated by Chinese scientists. Those same scientists who then left a window open, let it escape, and completely failed to stop it a second time.

    Much more likely it emerged the first time.

    Always rule out cock-up before assuming conspiracy.

    I suspect a number of Chinese low-ranking bureaucrats played down the problem to avoid being the bearer of bad news and this delayed the response long enough for the virus to spread. But that’s hardly China’s fault or even a uniquely Chinese problem: it’s a human one.
     
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    Last edited: May 3, 2020
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  4. Albert's Chip Shop

    Albert's Chip Shop Top Grafter
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    hey fella. Hope all is well!

    the fact that the outbreak started in Wuhan.. which happens to be the Chinese centre of their biological research centre is too much of a coincidence for me.

    a mate of mine lives in China and it’s apparently common knowledge that 40,000 caskets were shipped to wuhan by central government which is odd when their death toll is only a few thousand...
     
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  5. Albert's Chip Shop

    Albert's Chip Shop Top Grafter
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    Personally I think that they have certainly delayed telling the world about it and then lied about the facts. It’s a big thing in Chinese culture to salve face.

    Those elements alone could have saved Western lives.
     
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  6. Delusional Full Stop

    Delusional Full Stop Here to serve all your counselling needs.
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    Haven’t a clue where the virus started but pretty clear the Chinese authorities, at least at local level, tried to downplay and deny everything which has probably cost the World dearly and I’m talking lives here as opposed to money.

    In that respect China has a lot to answer for.

    I doubt we will ever know how it started but if any scientist who exists on this board knows better then I’m happy to listen.
     
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  7. GeordieHalfbreed

    GeordieHalfbreed Well-Known Member

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    Not my field, but this isn’t rocket science (if it were I’d be slightly better qualified to comment, but only slightly).

    We can sequence the genome of the virus quite easily. If it were artificial, it would have recognisable sequences inserted into a recognisable base genome to give the effects someone developing it would want. It doesn’t - it’s clearly evolved naturally through millions of generations of mutation. Therefore it’s of natural origin.

    There’s a good accessible article here:
    https://www.newscientist.com/term/coronavirus-come-lab/

    The underlying scientific publication is here: https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/22221751.2020.1733440

    Whether China had covered up the extent of the problem and the rate of fatalities to try and stabilise their own government? That’s another matter, and it wouldn’t surprise me in the least given the numbers elsewhere.

    However it’s also plausible that it’s much easier to implement a truly effective lockdown in a totalitarian society.
     
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  8. haslam

    haslam Well-Known Member

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    Let's be honest if America had been at fault would they be offering compensation to the rest of the world? Nonsense.

    They'll happily sell arms to dubious regimes who then cost other countries large amounts of money and life to combat. That's not even a theory, it's happened tons of times. Pretty sure they don't compensate for that and it's intentional!
     
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  9. Heed

    Heed well known cheat

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    Guilty as charged.

    If by some small chance it isn't from a lab, the Chinese government has been complicit and at the epicentre of a large scale cover-up, bringing the world to its knees.

    Nothing but a bunch of lying bastards.
     
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  10. Delusional Full Stop

    Delusional Full Stop Here to serve all your counselling needs.
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    It doesn’t seem from those articles that they are not a categoric 100% statement that the virus is natural as opposed to saying it would seem on a balance of possibilities that the virus is not man made. All a question of probabilities but it would seem that the scientific world believes the virus is natural and not man made and who am I to argue against that.
     
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  11. Delusional Full Stop

    Delusional Full Stop Here to serve all your counselling needs.
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    Can you not just get off the fence for a change and let us know what you think.

    <doh>
     
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  12. Albert's Chip Shop

    Albert's Chip Shop Top Grafter
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    Anecdotally I know a lot of people who from now on will try where possible to avoid buying anything made in China out of principle for what they perceived China has allowed to happen to the world.
     
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  13. Heed

    Heed well known cheat

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    You know me, not one for sitting on the fence.
    I therefore reiterate that they are as guilty as sin.
     
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  14. Delusional Full Stop

    Delusional Full Stop Here to serve all your counselling needs.
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    Actually you wouldn’t be allowed to sit on Ben 10’s fence, newly painted, varnished etc.
     
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  15. GeordieHalfbreed

    GeordieHalfbreed Well-Known Member

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    Science is by definition a matter of the balance of probabilities - generally speaking someone who tells you something science-based is probably correct is more likely to be telling the truth than someone who says FACT in capital letters.

    Unfortunately sometimes people conflate something being true on the balance of probabilities with “Nobody knows for sure, so my gut instinct is as valid as any other theory”
     
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  16. JulioGeordio90

    JulioGeordio90 Well-Known Member

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    This completely hits the nail on the head for me. Particularly the latter part. China were able to lock down a city in a way we could never do in the UK. The concept of foregoing certain liberties in return for protection/safeguards is cemented in China in a way it isn't here. Look at the controversy in the UK over a contact tracing app.
     
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  17. Consett Mag

    Consett Mag Well-Known Member

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    Looks like a screw up at the lab. It shouldn't have got out.
     
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  18. Warmir Pouchov

    Warmir Pouchov Better than JPF

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    For me a naturally occurring problem which China tried to conceal. They have history in this regard.

    In terms of holding them accountable, not gonna happen and nor should it. Not unless we are gonna hold all countries accountable for their behaviours which have global consequences. Ourselves and the US better delve deep! China will laugh at any attempts and simply pay enough lip service to maintain economic relations. It’s ****house what they did but such was the lax attitude, it would have spread anyway. Our arrogance would have ensured that. That’s why we are so badly prepared despite being warned continuously over the last 10yrs by the scientific community that this was our greatest threat.
     
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  19. Geordieginola

    Geordieginola Well-Known Member

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    So what you saying. Just kidding.

    Yes I read this. It is natural but not necessarily not natural how It got into the human race. They know for a fact where it originated from. What they don’t know is who patient x is and when they got infected however the concentration of cases around that market leads them to believe this was the starting point. And it is viable aswell.

    Like you say the time delay and the spread could have been halted if China had reacted faster. Also they where even stopping scientists warning the world. THAT is why the world is annoyed with China.
     
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  20. Darren Peacock’s Ponytail

    Darren Peacock’s Ponytail Well-Known Member

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    All I would say is that the US and UK have to be just as culpable in how they dealt with it.

    Herd immunity

    It's just flu
     
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