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The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Monday 24th February)

Discussion in 'Leeds United' started by ellandback, Feb 24, 2020.

  1. Whitejock

    Whitejock Well-Known Member

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    I think it was worth signing him & we could have been reaping the rewards from hereon in if we'd have been allowed to keep him & continue easing him into Bielsaball. He was talented & malleable, which is what you look for. Unfortunately it didn't work out, which is clearly suiting him & Arsenal. He's gone, so end of. No point in speculating what could have been.
     
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  2. davy

    davy Well-Known Member

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    Happy Monday troops.

    It does my head in - mostly on the right, Pablo, Klich and Ayling most guilty with Costa the intended recipient, it is forbidden for anyone to cross until they reach the byline with 24 passes.

    Even then, bonus points for dribbling toward the near post with nobody to cut the ball back to as they're all behind you on the right.

    <doh><laugh>
     
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  3. Whitejock

    Whitejock Well-Known Member

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    Why do you think Bamford need rested & has low confidence? He's been missing sitters all career, and even manages it consistently when he's on a scoring streak. We always knew he was streaky, but dropping him has never coincided with a streak on his return. He's playing his usual game. Goalscoring ups & downs - but all the other attributes are bang on - and very important to the team. Why does no-one look back & see that? He is what he is, & I cannot believe that resting him will solve anything. Whilst Bielsa can appear to have favourites, it's also perfectly clear that he can be utterly ruthless. If Bamford needed a rest, you can be damn sure Bielsa would enforce it.

    Now a backup is a different matter, and at the moment, that's what Augustin is. Or nearly is, to be precise. He's being brought up to speed as the opportunities present themselves. Saturday gone was an example of there being zero chance of him playing whist we played out the 1-0. On the few occasions he has played, he's shown nothing to convince me that he's anywhere close to replacing Bamford. So far he's been a headless chicken with potential. Hopefully this will change. I also don't buy this 'match fitness' cover-all. Do you need to be match fit to press & run your bollox off? Fit, yes, match fit, no. Yet I've so far not seen him attempt it in anything like the level Bamford achieves. He doesn't even appear to show willing. In effect, we'd be playing Bielsaball with 10 men & a poacher. Do you really want that?

    Btw, I for one am delighted that 'Mr Stubborn' is stubborn. So was the Don & Sgt Wilco. Pattern? Hope so. Can't remember many complaining about them. They took time to achieve too.
     
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    Last edited: Feb 24, 2020
  4. Whitejock

    Whitejock Well-Known Member

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    As I remarked on Saturday at ER - our wingers are exactly the opposite to Beckham (love him or hate him). Master of the early ball & the dead ball. I'd be happy if our wingers could even achieve one of the two. The thing is, I believe they're playing to orders. Can't be a coincidence that all our wingers can't get an early ball in. Takes me back to my conversation with Douglas when I asked why we didn't fling in a long throw. Upshot of the more detailed conversation was him saying "Well, then we'd be fukn Cardiff!".
     
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  5. Infidel

    Infidel Well-Known Member

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    On Saturday, I tracked Bamford,s movement specifically, first of all this player is very fit, knows to to hold a ball up and feed off to team mates, he knows how and can annoy the opposition (reminded me of Jonny Giles in how he put his foot in, Giles crocked plenty of players in his time)
    On the attacking front Bamford never once run into the space in front of his marker anticipating a cross coming in the box, he always stood the other side of the defender, 9 times out of 10 the balls put onto the box were sub standard and have been all season.
    Again Costa and Harrison couldn’t cross a road, and I personally cannot understand why Amigo doesn’t swap them over even if it’s just for 15 minute spells!!!! I am beginning to think Bielsaball is regimental football and majority of the players we have cannot adapt.
     
    #25
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  6. lifecheshirewhite

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    What evidence are you looking at, goals per minute were much better, and he won us points we wouldn't have got otherwise.
     
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  7. FORZA LEEDS

    FORZA LEEDS Well-Known Member

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    The evidence of when Bamford was replaced by Nketiah the team as a whole looked worse.
     
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  8. DJMarl

    DJMarl Well-Known Member

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    I don't want him rested because he is tired. I want him rested to give the new guy a chance. When they signed Augustin, it must have been because he is a comparable type of player that would act as a backup or replace Bamford if or when required.

    If he hasnt got a similar skill set to Bamford, why did they bother? The skill set offered by Bamford is key to 'Mr Stubborns' system,. I get that.. We haven't seen anything from Augustin yet, but we aren't going to see anything unless Bamford gets banned or injured. I suggested playing Augustin for 45 mins, i.e. the whole 2nd half which would allow Bamford to continue starting as Beilsa wants and also give Augustin a chance..

    Match fitness is being sharp as a knife coupled with tip top fitness, I agree may be have the latter, but definitely not the former as it stands.. Mental fitness and adaption to the Championship style of football is quite a shock to some players, he could be one of them..He cant get this experience by sitting on the bench.

    No I don't want that, but to be fair on him, we haven't seen enough of him yet. Personally I think its too early to judge him on his appearances as of yet..

    For the record, I think Bielsa is the best manager we have had a a very long time. He is meticulous about everything, and I am sure he has his reasons for playing Bamford (which we all know its about the other aspects of his play) in the starting 11 all the time, despite not scoring goals. I am just frustrated (maybe with the club more than the manager) that we don't seem to have any light at the end of the tunnel regarding our lack of converting our chances.

    Dont get me wrong I may be completely wrong about Augustin, he may end up being completely ****e, dare I say it like Brolin or Junior, but we'll never know unless he gets game time. Playing for the reserves just isnt enough is it?
     
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  9. Whitejock

    Whitejock Well-Known Member

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    Can't remember if it was Forza or Davy, but one of them said they'd prefer playing as-is Bamford & all he brings, to the possibility that Augustine may be better, plus the loss of impetus whilst we wait on him coming up to scratch (think they worded it a lot better). Your suggestion could cost us serious points if Augustine cannot provide the contribution that Bamford currently provides. On the evidence of what we've seen, he's either unable or doesn't want to press, for instance. His efforts at pressing are diabolical & his hold up play little better. Doesn't matter if you play 9 minutes or 90 minutes - Bielsaball demands 90 minutes of effort from every player. He has done absolutely nothing so far to indicate that he understands this. Playing someone of that capability, attitude or whatever could be terminal for us.
     
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    Last edited: Feb 24, 2020
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  10. Leedsoflondon

    Leedsoflondon Well-Known Member

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    Whilst I don’t agree that Bielsa is Mr. Stubborn, I do think that apart from injury it is really difficult to break into his starting 11. When asked about how you restore a player’s confidence (referring to Kiko) he said by showing the player faith and belief in him during the bad spell. He doesn’t like to change a winning team so there you have it. Play well and you stay in the team, play badly you stay in the team till you start playing well again.
     
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  11. ristac

    ristac Well-Known Member
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    After the Nottingham Forest result, how many of us were demanding changes (I include myself in that)? Bielsa ignored the fans (rightly so) and we have managed seven valuable points and could and should have been 9 opening up a 5 point gap.

    I agree with WJ and a few others, if Augustin cannot press and hold the ball up as is required to do so by Bielsa then it throws everything out the window, just one player not doing that would create gaps and and I believe our overall play would suffer.
     
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  12. lifecheshirewhite

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    Well agreed he didn't run around like a headless chicken like Bamford, but his goals per minute played showed he was much more likely to score, which is what a strikers job is. So we didn't pass it around at the back as good, but we did win more and score more, which is the whole point isn't it, or am I missing something.
    He started the last 2 games before he left, a 5-4 win at Birmingham, and a 1-1 draw at top of the table WBA, So what did we lose in them games ?.
     
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    Last edited: Feb 24, 2020
  13. Leedsoflondon

    Leedsoflondon Well-Known Member

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    I agree but I also agree with the point of view of why loan him? Presumption must be he is good enough / similar enough to Bamford to step in if needed?
     
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  14. lifecheshirewhite

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    If a striker stays up front he will still force 2 defenders to stay back with him, so if our other ten players aren't good enough to get the better of 9 Wigan or Sheffield wed average type players, then maybe we should play Bamford and get rid of the other 10 worse than average players.
     
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  15. Whitejock

    Whitejock Well-Known Member

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    5 goals & 2 points.

    The stat I'd love to see is how many goals were scored against us with him on the field. The reason? I think it's fairly obvious he didn't fit in with the teams excellent press / defence which saw us having the best defensive record in Europe, so we suffered.

    Not, I don't have the stats. Don't even know if they exist. But pretty sure I'm on to something. And I believe it's been a lesson learned, hence Big Kev's slow progress.
     
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  16. LeedsLover

    LeedsLover Well-Known Member

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    You're obviously hiding cowardly behind a sludgy rock, don't you know how to spell LL then.
     
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  17. LeedsLover

    LeedsLover Well-Known Member

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    Do good strikers need clear cut chances Eire, or do good strikers also create their own..............either way, we haven't got a good striker playing at moment.
     
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  18. milkyboy

    milkyboy Well-Known Member

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    you called yourself rooster the other day... I thought it was more polite than Gessa’s choice of phrase
     
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  19. blonogasoven

    blonogasoven Well-Known Member

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    Strikers are paid to score goals but is Bamford a striker? He plays in the middle of a front 3, just as Firmino does for the team running away with the Prem. Firmino has scored 10, Bamford 12.
    That aside, Managers are paid, in the Championship, to pick a team to get enough points for autos.
    We are currently 5 points clear of 3rd place so, all the stubbornness and favouritism is obviously working.
    If we were mid table or near the bottom then Bielsa would be a fair target but ffs! What does he have to do?

    I've never managed a side, well apart from winning the treble with Leeds in Football Manager in 2002, so I bow down to Bielsa's better judgement.
     
    #39
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  20. Gessa

    Gessa Well-Known Member

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    Mine was so much more apt though.
     
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