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Off Topic The Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Queens Park Rangers' started by Stroller, Jun 25, 2015.

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Should the UK remain a part of the EU or leave?

Poll closed Jun 24, 2016.
  1. Stay in

    56 vote(s)
    47.9%
  2. Get out

    61 vote(s)
    52.1%
  1. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    Fair enough
    I don't know anything about either of em
    Could be a pair of ****s
     
    #20861
  2. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    please log in to view this image


    will it actually fly or just be a couple of feet above any people that turn up like the last balloon
     
    #20862
  3. West London Willy

    West London Willy Well-Known Member

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    Paul Manafort, Campaign Manager for Trump's 2016 election campaign, was yesterday found guilty of eight charges of tax fraud, bank fraud, and failing to disclose foreign bank accounts. A further ten charges failed to reach a verdict and a mistrial was called, meaning that he will be retried on these.

    On the same day, Trump's "Mr Fix-It" lawyer Michael Cohen pleaded guilty to violating campaign finance laws by paying off porn star Stormy Daniels and Playmate Karen McDougal on behalf of, and at the direction of, Trump (referred to as 'an unnamed candidate for federal office' in the statement, but it sure as hell wasn't Hillary) just before the election in 2016 with (quote) "the principal purpose of influencing the election." (end quote). Cohen pleaded guilty to counts of tax evasion, making false statements to a financial institution, willfully causing an unlawful corporate contribution and making an excessive campaign contribution at the request of a candidate or campaign.

    Now - whilst the charges that Manafort was found guilty of don't implicitly tie Trump and Russia together, one of the charges apparently makes a direct connection between receiving money through loans from a Russian-owned bank at the same time that Trump was talking about Russia being readmitted to the G7/G8, and sanctions over their annexation of Crimea being lifted.

    Cohen? Well, he's just thrown Trump under the bus. Bear in mind that the FBI has literally millions of documents from the raids on his home, office and his rooms at Trump Hotel. a very small number have been deemed 'client-attorney privilege', meaning that the rest are fair game for Special Counsel Mueller. His charges to date could see him locked up for 65 years (hence his plea deal) and whilst it's clear that the information already in the hands of the prosecutors shows the extent to which the Trump campaign, and subsequent presidency, has violated constitutional law to effectively steal the presidency (on behalf of either himself, the GOP, the Russians, the big corporations, or more likely a combination of all of these) having someone from the inner circle validate this through sworn testimony means there's really nowhere left for Trump to go. Tick tick tick tick....

    It's just a matter of time now, and not much time at that. The question being asked is what reaction will Republican senators and congressmen show? Will they continue to support someone they must know is in direct violation of the Constitution and election law (laying aside all the rest of his bad character traits like racism, sexism, xenophobia and self-centered greed) or will they finally show some patriotism and wok to remove this stain from office?
     
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  4. QPR999

    QPR999 Well-Known Member
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    Jesus! Am I still alright to have the odd can of Lilt every now and then?
     
    #20864
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  5. qprbeth

    qprbeth Wicked Witch of West12
    Forum Moderator

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    You certainly don't see much of um bongo nowadays...mind you it was disgusting muck to drink

    Sent from my STF-L09 using Tapatalk
     
    #20865
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  6. DT’s Socks

    DT’s Socks Well-Known Member

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    Can’t get into the trump thing at all
    Has no real bearing on our country imo sorry
    Become a invogue subject like McDonald’s, Ryanair etc etc

    I actually like the way he has broken the mould on politics in a country I don’t care much about. A lot worse things happening in the world than Trump

    A lot worse things happened in the US under other presidents

    The man looks a complete puppet to me

    But look what we have in the UK ?
     
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  7. West London Willy

    West London Willy Well-Known Member

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    Well, I find it hard to understand how the US President 'has no real bearing on our country', clearly that's not exactly true. So much of US life affects us - economic, political, military, scientific, culturally, stuff that happens there tends to happen here.

    However, the thing is: it's possible to be angry at the way UK politics is being mishandled at the present, and still find issue with a person like Trump, who:
    • broke campaign finance laws, instructing his lawyer to pay off a porn star and a playboy model (and it's believed several others, including paying for abortions) so that the stories didn't appear before the election;
    • calls his campaign manager (who is in jail having been convicted of eight tax and financial crimes) a 'good man' that he 'feels sorry' for;
    • faces up to seventeen sexual harassment and assault cases, including the alleged rape of a thirteen year old girl;
    • openly disparages blacks, Hispanics, women, the disabled, LGBTQ, whilst calling white supremacist marchers 'very fine people' after they kill an anti-fascist protester by running her down with a car;
    • calls the press 'the enemy of the people' just because they won't suck up to him;
    • wails on Twitter like a three-year-old about 'witch-hunts';
    • is doing everything possible to kill the environment;
    • rips children from their parents, loses the children, deports the parents, and then does NOTHING to find the kids and reunite the families;
    • rips the heart out of the US welfare infrastructure to pass trillions of dollars to his wealthy cronies;
    • actively conspired with Russia to steal the election
    There's so much more, but that's all without any googling. And it's all coming out in the Mueller investigation. Manafort will tell everything. Cohen IS telling everything. Trump is having a twitter meltdown today because he's so scared that the truth has finally caught up with him.

    I care about all of that. I also care that our politicians are running our country into the ground on ideological grounds.
     
    #20867
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  8. DT’s Socks

    DT’s Socks Well-Known Member

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    Let’s hope he tops himself
    The world will carry on
    We need to stop looking st the USA imo it’s not a good place
     
    #20868
  9. Staines R's

    Staines R's Well-Known Member

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    Your best post in years, Paul
     
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  10. Staines R's

    Staines R's Well-Known Member

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    The Saudi regime bombs kids and beheads people who speak out against them......
     
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  11. KooPeeArr

    KooPeeArr Well-Known Member

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    That's a bit spurious.

    You can't have an issue with someone because there's someone else who is worse.

    Does this mean you shouldn't sympathise with somebody who suffers because there will, undoubtedly, be someone else in greater pain.

    I don't doubt that all of us would be happier if we didn't deal arms to the Saudis and weren't reliant on their oil and wealth (I assume that is the reason why our government is so unwilling to address their abysmal human rights or the media gives them a relatively easy ride).

    However, like it or not, our society is infused with American influence to the point where they're barely discernable (and this predates Trump by a good few decades). Focusing on politics, we can see a mirror of the dubious campaigns and the negative smear campaigns rather than genuine policy or ideology. Perhaps having an issue with the Russian owned, self-serving, bigoted leader of the free world, the corrupt and misogynistic man that happens to be the most powerful in global politics, isn't that unnatural a place to hope that the rot that creeps into our everyday lives can start to be redressed.
     
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  12. Staines R's

    Staines R's Well-Known Member

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    What I’m getting at is this weird fascination that some people have with protesting against Trump and his policies (which I too dislike), where as they are quite happy to let other more despotic regimes across the world get away with it......in my opinion it’s because it’s ‘trendy’ to knock Trump whereas others are less so.

    And before Willy gets upset and says I’m picking on him, I honestly and truly am not singling him out.....I just find the whole thing rather hypocritical and always have.
     
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  13. KooPeeArr

    KooPeeArr Well-Known Member

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    I'm not trying to single you out either and, barring the proliferation of US news that we get in the UK (again this predates Trump) I take your point (I'm not the kind of person that actively protests anything for what it's worth).

    It is true that where America leads, we generally follow and we are already too close to a place, morally speaking, where I for one, would rather not be.

    I don't think the same can be said for Saudi Arabia.
     
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  14. Staines R's

    Staines R's Well-Known Member

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    I understand what you’re saying and take your point, and I used Saudi Arabia as just an example.
    I just can’t get why people here are willing to march in their thousands against Trump but can’t get off their arses to protest against the policy of ‘poor doors’ or the gentrification of working class areas.
    I can only think it’s because it’s ‘hip’ to protest one and not the other.
     
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    Last edited: Aug 22, 2018
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  15. West London Willy

    West London Willy Well-Known Member

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    I know. I very much know. As I told DT, it’s possible to be against several things.
     
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  16. rangercol

    rangercol Well-Known Member

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    I reckon it's something to do with the fact that a lot of those on the left (not you clearly) seem to be anti-American as a default position.
     
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  17. West London Willy

    West London Willy Well-Known Member

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    For the record, I’m centre (possibly a little centre-right), love America, and despise what Trump is doing to the nation.
     
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  18. Staines R's

    Staines R's Well-Known Member

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    You actually might have a very valid point there Col. The US are quite often seen on my side as the ‘big bad devil’......whereas in my view, there are many millions of working class in America who are being ****ed over just as much as we are in the U.K. are.
    It’s a Class War (that was for you Stan) ;)
     
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  19. Staines R's

    Staines R's Well-Known Member

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    Ok Willy.....and I do emphasise it’s not a personal attack on you.
    It’s just I don’t get why the great protest thing against Trump but not against policies and wrongs much closer to home.
     
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  20. Sooperhoop

    Sooperhoop Well-Known Member

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    It's a 'sheep' thing, go on Twatter and it's full of morons who take offence at the slightest thing and hunt in packs anyone who says the slightest thing that doesn't fit with their view. Labour is chock full of virtue-signalling half-wits who 'police' social media looking for anyone who doesn't fit their position and 'free-thinkers' get a hard time.

    There are elements of most political parties that I like and dislike in equal measures, those who blindly follow political dogma and vilify individuals or other groups are just as big a part of the problem...
     
    #20880
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