Off Topic The Goodhand Arms

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fran-MLs little camera said:
If threatened in your own home at night I don't see why you have to give the benefit of the doubt to the burglar. People have been tortured and killed in their own homes....if you get a chance you take it....and I don't think you go for a minor wound either. You want this person down and out....not maddened with you.
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It's the inconsistency that I don't get. My pub got burgled one night, and I woke up and crept downstairs to find a couple of lowlives wheeling the cigarette machine over towards a window that had been forced open. I grabbed the nearest thing (which happened to be a cast iron barstool) and swung that a few times with fairly bloody results. They both legged it, or as close to legging it that you can manage after being smashed around the head with metal furniture and were quickly picked up whilst they were trying to stop the bleeding a couple of streets over.
The Old Bill told me that they were repeat offenders who usually went armed with knives, and that they'd let me know when the court case happened so that I could watch the sentencing. The blood evidence found in my pub was important in the end and helped secure a conviction and custodial sentence.
At no time during this event did the Police ever consider bringing charges against me for assault or GBH, and one officer even thanked me and said that I'd sent a fairly loud message out there that burglary is a hazardous profession.
What I don't understand is why this latest case even attracted a charge against the householder, despite all the existing guidelines that allow for heat of the moment actions when confronted in your home when I wasn't even cautioned. I mentioned to one of the officers that they were lucky it wasn't a knife that had been the first thing I'd laid my hands on as I'd have used that just as happily as a 40lb stool and I certainly got the impression from him that they didn't really care what happened to the burglars...what has changed?
 
Rorschach's Journal said:
It's the inconsistency that I don't get. My pub got burgled one night, and I woke up and crept downstairs to find a couple of lowlives wheeling the cigarette machine over towards a window that had been forced open. I grabbed the nearest thing (which happened to be a cast iron barstool) and swung that a few times with fairly bloody results. They both legged it, or as close to legging it that you can manage after being smashed around the head with metal furniture and were quickly picked up whilst they were trying to stop the bleeding a couple of streets over.
The Old Bill told me that they were repeat offenders who usually went armed with knives, and that they'd let me know when the court case happened so that I could watch the sentencing. The blood evidence found in my pub was important in the end and helped secure a conviction and custodial sentence.
At no time during this event did the Police ever consider bringing charges against me for assault or GBH, and one officer even thanked me and said that I'd sent a fairly loud message out there that burglary is a hazardous profession.
What I don't understand is why this latest case even attracted a charge against the householder, despite all the existing guidelines that allow for heat of the moment actions when confronted in your home when I wasn't even cautioned. I mentioned to one of the officers that they were lucky it wasn't a knife that had been the first thing I'd laid my hands on as I'd have used that just as happily as a 40lb stool and I certainly got the impression from him that they didn't really care what happened to the burglars...what has changed?
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From what I have read it was to do with the body of the bloke who was stabbed being found outside the guys home and down the street, which could indicate that he chased after the guy and stabbed him. Which would bring charges as if someone is running away from you and you stab them then it is not defending yourself.

The more logical reason would be that the pensioner stabbed the guy and he staggered out of the house and collapsed further along down the street, but I guess that is not clear when they have to come up with charges?
 
Saintmagic said:
From what I have read it was to do with the body of the bloke who was stabbed being found outside the guys home and down the street, which could indicate that he chased after the guy and stabbed him. Which would bring charges as if someone is running away from you and you stab them then it is not defending yourself.

The more logical reason would be that the pensioner stabbed the guy and he staggered out of the house and collapsed further along down the street, but I guess that is not clear when they have to come up with charges?
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That first paragraph would suggest that a 78 year old chased and caught up with a 37 year old?
Another thing I read was that the burglar had been part of a group that scammed £72000 out of an oap, for changing one roof tile. A thoroughly nice bloke, not.
 
Personally I would defend my home with whatever came to hand..........Including a knife and I certainly would not be shy in using it. Most burglars though do come armed with something so should not be surprised if if someone had a go at them with similar. I came home on leave in the 60's unexpectedly it was about 3.00 in the morning that I waltzed in to my mothers house. Only to find two lads about the same age as me (17 or so) stealing from the garage. The silly boys went after me swinging a baseball bat. They broke three of my fingers but I still managed to disarm them, although I dislocated a shoulder of one of them and did damage to the other ones face, the one that hit me with the bat. In court they tried to sue me for assault although I am glad to say it was thrown out of court. I even had one of their dads come for me later after they had been sentenced to time in a young offenders institution. I dislocated my knuckle on his head and unfortunately broke his nose. I received £100 pound compensation for my dislocated finger and £30 each from the boys because of their assault.
The father was fined £500 I seemed to remember........... The £100 pound and the £30 was quite a lot of money at the time as was the £500!!
I really cannot understand the police's motive in prosecuting other than maybe they are frightened that this would become the norm if they didn't. Burglars beware is all I Would say.
 
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St Badger said:
That first paragraph would suggest that a 78 year old chased and caught up with a 37 year old?
Another thing I read was that the burglar had been part of a group that scammed £72000 out of an oap, for changing one roof tile. A thoroughly nice bloke, not.
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Yeah I don't think that is what happened, just that it is a possibility so until they can prove that he was stabbed in the home and the pensioner was acting in self defence I guess they have to treat it as a potential murder.

Wasn't there a case a few years ago of somebody shooting some burglars as they ran from his home and he got done for it?
 
The man was probably charged, so that they could interview him under caution. Probably routine until the facts are ascertained. I just hope the charges are dropped soon though as the man is a carer for his wife with dementia. He must be stressed as whatever the provocation it must be awful to kill someone.
 
Don't believe the Daily Mail / Express hysteria that you can't defend yourself in your house.

My bro' is a criminal defence solicitor. He has arrived for Police interviews where the accused burglar has clearly been on the receiving end of a damned good kicking from the householder. The Police are NOT interested at all. Their attitude is "yeah, that's how he was when we arrested him, odd".

The only reason anyone was even questioned in this case was because the guy died. Would you really want the Police not to follow up on a death?

Tony Martin (Daily Mail hero) was prosecuted because he lay in wait armed with an illegally-held shotgun and shot someone in the back. He'd previously shot at the car of someone stealing apples from his orchard.

Actually, just don't believe the Daily Mail or the Express in general.

Vin
 
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Saintmagic said:
Yeah I don't think that is what happened, just that it is a possibility so until they can prove that he was stabbed in the home and the pensioner was acting in self defence I guess they have to treat it as a potential murder.

Wasn't there a case a few years ago of somebody shooting some burglars as they ran from his home and he got done for it?
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Yes the man got 12 years later reduced to 3 on appeal.......
 
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At last the police seemed to have used their brains............Fair result although no doubt some will disagree..........
 
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/9...lia-poisoning-health-improving-rapidly-russia

Sergei Skripal no longer in a critical condition. Interesting that they are recovering from a poison said to be unsurvivable.....I wonder if this is connected to research at Porton Down. If any establishment would know how to treat nerve agents it would be Porton Down. Their research must be mainly looking for counter-agents.
 
fran-MLs little camera said:
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/9...lia-poisoning-health-improving-rapidly-russia

Sergei Skripal no longer in a critical condition. Interesting that they are recovering from a poison said to be unsurvivable.....I wonder if this is connected to research at Porton Down. If any establishment would know how to treat nerve agents it would be Porton Down. Their research must be mainly looking for counter-agents.
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Unless, of course, they have developed a survivable nerve agent and wanted to give it a field trial? Just saying...
 
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fran-MLs little camera said:
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/9...lia-poisoning-health-improving-rapidly-russia

Sergei Skripal no longer in a critical condition. Interesting that they are recovering from a poison said to be unsurvivable.....I wonder if this is connected to research at Porton Down. If any establishment would know how to treat nerve agents it would be Porton Down. Their research must be mainly looking for counter-agents.
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Something very fishy about this whole nerve agent episode. I dont see what the benifit for russia is .so many other ways they could have killed the ex double agent
 
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