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Off Topic The Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Queens Park Rangers' started by Stroller, Jun 25, 2015.

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Should the UK remain a part of the EU or leave?

Poll closed Jun 24, 2016.
  1. Stay in

    56 vote(s)
    47.9%
  2. Get out

    61 vote(s)
    52.1%
  1. Stroller

    Stroller Well-Known Member

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    This is Mary Creagh's Article 50 speech. Perhaps she should be leader of the Opposition...........

    Mr Speaker the European Union is a bureaucratic,cumbersome, imperfect system. But it is the longest and most successful peace process the world has ever seen It has transformed historic enemies into trading partners, allies, and friends. It gave hope to those labouring under the yoke of communism. It has protected the UK’s workers, consumers and environment, supported the Northern Ireland peace process, and driven Britain’s economy, innovation and prosperity. I did not vote to hold the referendum. I campaigned to remain. But people in Wakefield voted to leave.

    The Labour whip says vote to trigger. But my Labour values, solidarity, internationalism, social justice, say something else.
    Because I see the Prime Minister talking about free trade, but walking out on the largest free trade area in the world. To chase an imaginary trade deal with Donald Trump. Populism and nationalism lead to protectionism. Protectionism destroys trade. People get poorer. People blame someone. We turn our back on openness, on tolerance, on other people. We forget they are people like us.

    A trade deal with the USA is a distraction. The most important trade deal is the one we negotiate with the European Union. That deal will determine whether Esseco UK in Wakefield face tariffs on the sulphites they export to wine makers in the EU. Or if Wakefield farmers face tariffs on the lamb they export to Belgium.
    The Prime minister has a weak negotiating hand. But she has thrown in her cards before the other players have sat down at the table! She has rejected staying in the Single market, where 44% of the UK’s exports currently go, tariff free. This hard Brexit was not what Leave campaigners told people in the referendum. The UK’s access to the largest free trade area in the world will be worse after 2019. That puts thousands of British jobs at risk.

    An open society, without discrimination, is the founding pillar of our British and European identity. Since the referendum, hate crime is up. There is fear and uncertainty for thousands of our teachers, nurses, carers, our co-workers, neighbours, and friends. My father Tom died in October. The last vote he cast was to remain in the EU. He came to Britain from Ireland, in 1962, to earn his living, meet his wife, get his degree, raise his family, work and pay his taxes here. After Brexit, someone like him, without a degree, say, from Eastern Europe, will no longer be welcome. I hope we are better than that. This vote means our children will have fewer rights to live, work, and study in Europe than we had. Their wildlife, and countryside will suffer when we lose the EU’s environmental protections. This vote diminishes Britain’s place in the world.

    To the people of Wakefield, I say, I have always sought to act in your best interests. My duty is to use my judgement to make your lives better. You did not elect me to make you poorer. To destroy your jobs and weaken your public services. My judgement, as someone who lived in Belgium and Italy and who worked with entrepreneurs for 7 years; as an elected public servant for the last 19 years; my judgement is this vote will make people in Wakefield poorer, will destroy jobs and businesses, remove social, consumer and environmental rights, and reduce the tax base that funds our NHS, schools and council services.

    It helps the right wing of the Conservative party and it is the wrong future for our country. History has its eyes on us today. So here is my answer. I can no more vote for this than I can vote against my conscience.
    I can no more vote for this than I can vote against my Labour values. I can no more vote for this than I can vote against my own DNA. I did not vote to hold the referendum. And I will not vote to trigger Article 50 today".
     
    #8601
  2. ELLERS

    ELLERS Well-Known Member

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    Shame it didn't mention all the heartache, unemployment, the globalization of certain companies that have had a huge impact on local workers and communities. Or the unfair advantage Germany has over the smaller nations or the crooked deals that go on behind the scenes. The EU project is rotten. They couldn't even protect countries from Russia. The only thing that kept peace in Europe was Nato or more importantly the US.
     
    #8602
    cor blymie and rangercol like this.
  3. rangercol

    rangercol Well-Known Member

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    You do love to lecture don't you?
     
    #8603
    sheffordqpr likes this.
  4. sheffordqpr

    sheffordqpr Well-Known Member

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    Bliar must think we are all f*cking thick. Misleading information, my arse!! I voted to leave because had used my own experience and because of the research I had done. We are not all daft Mr BLIAR. F*cking pompous c*nt!! Effectively, he has said that just over half of the voters are stupid enough to vote whilst ill informed. Not me mate!! I'm f(cking livid that this lying, murderous bastard assumes anything about the people of this country. If he can assume anything, it is that most of us think he took us in to a war that was not necessary and lives were lost because of his glory hunting. W*ANKER!
     
    #8604
    ELLERS and rangercol like this.
  5. Star of David Bardsley

    Star of David Bardsley 2023 Funniest Poster

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    I've not read his quotes but I think people were misinformed. It wasn't really a debate between two sides telling the truth about the outcome should they win but more a race to hook enough people to believe them. Lots of people would have studied up the merits of both outcomes but I do think a lot more were drawn in by lies from the Leave campaign.
     
    #8605
  6. QPR Oslo

    QPR Oslo Well-Known Member

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    Mary! Stand Up!
     
    #8606
  7. finglasqpr

    finglasqpr Well-Known Member

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    and.....the first time a Nato country needed NATO to protect it's borders (Ukraine), Nato were no where to be seen.
     
    #8607
  8. sheffordqpr

    sheffordqpr Well-Known Member

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    I don't doubt that there were mistruths - on both sides. What pisses me off more than anything with toss pot hypocrite Bliar is that he thinks we are ALL stupid enough not to educate ourselves about such an important piece of our future. That is an insult.
     
    #8608
  9. Star of David Bardsley

    Star of David Bardsley 2023 Funniest Poster

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    Did he actually say that?
     
    #8609
  10. sheffordqpr

    sheffordqpr Well-Known Member

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    Not as straightforwardly, but he was a politician. Ergo he twists and turns like a twisty turny thing (credit Lord Melchet).
     
    #8610
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  11. GoldhawkRoad

    GoldhawkRoad Well-Known Member

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    There was indeed a strident group in favour of leaving the EU during the Blair years who had a democratic right to speak. The difference is, none of them should have been up before the International Criminal Court for war crimes
     
    #8611
  12. Star of David Bardsley

    Star of David Bardsley 2023 Funniest Poster

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    Not really relevant though, is it? Plenty of politicians across the spectrum have **** and/or blood on their hands.
     
    #8612
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  13. GoldhawkRoad

    GoldhawkRoad Well-Known Member

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    True, but if it had been Kim Jong-un, it would have been worse. Mind you, given Blair's cosy relationship with dicators and despots to further his extensive business interests, there's still time...
     
    #8613
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  14. GoldhawkRoad

    GoldhawkRoad Well-Known Member

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    Can't think of any other UK politicians that lied to take us into a war of the gravity of the Iraq war, with worldwide fall out that will be felt for decades to come.

    Who had you in mind?
     
    #8614
    rangercol likes this.
  15. durbar2003

    durbar2003 Well-Known Member

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    When did the Ukraine join NATO Fingy? I'd hate to get into a Taxi with you.
     
    #8615
  16. rangercol

    rangercol Well-Known Member

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    Really?
    The remain camp had almost the entire establishment threatening all sorts from emergency budgets to World War 3!
    They also brought over the UK hating President of the United States to threaten us that we would go to "the back of the queue" for a trade deal if we dared to defy Cameron and Osborne.
    I believe that many voters who voted remain did so entirely because they were scared ****less by the cacophony of lies and false warnings they were bombarded with daily (I know many people who did just that, but who are now pleased with the result).

    This country has wanted to leave the EU for as long as I can remember, which is why the establishment have dodged the issue for so long. There were lies on both sides, but imo the vote would have been more conclusively "leave" had both camps stuck to the facts.
     
    #8616
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  17. Star of David Bardsley

    Star of David Bardsley 2023 Funniest Poster

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    I think it's best we just agree to disagree on this one now.
     
    #8617
  18. ELLERS

    ELLERS Well-Known Member

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    Finglas, I don't know if you are agreeing or disagreeing with me? At the end of the day it was an EU problem and they sat and did nothing. They want some sort of EU army as well!<yikes> Can you imagine being protected by French and Italian troops? They would have 3-hour lunch breaks then change sides.
    Sorry but I think Nato has been the best deterrent. :emoticon-0148-yes:
     
    #8618
  19. durbar2003

    durbar2003 Well-Known Member

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    I think NATO might be the longest most successful peace process the world has ever seen"
     
    #8619
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  20. KentGaz

    KentGaz Well-Known Member

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    That's how he won 3 General Elections, the British public are stupid and misinformed.
    I've never liked him.
     
    #8620

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