I just think that assuming employers have advanced in their ethical stance towards their workers, to the point that unions are obsolete, is ****ing naive. Jobs are moved offshore to places where it's easier to exploit people. That's reason to modernise and globalise the trade union movement, not to abolish it.
Hopefully we will be able to get one that can update the Prediction League on a regular basis - a Nevbot.
Think the need for better worker representation has never been greater but not sure that Unions necessarily provide that. When we had large State-run companies (National Coal Board etc) they made sense as they could collectively bargain on behalf of large numbers of employees. However with privatisation and numerous companies involved in providing the same service in different ways company-specific employee representative groups make more sense as long as they cannot be just ignored by the company management. The gap between Senior Management and Worker salaries, particularly in companies with tradeable shares, has been rising steadily since the 90's with blips only associated with global financial crashes, as shareholders reward management with large bonuses for maximising income and keeping costs (including worker salaries) down, thus increasing dividends. Not sure whether it's a coincidence that this occurred as Union Power was being eroded. Don't think anybody deserves to be harrassed by Union reps in the street (apart from Albert of course).
I think you're addressing a different point to the one I was making. I see no sign of employer's ethical standards being raised. I also don't see any sign of unions' ethical standards being any higher than employers'. If you want to say that a new, modernised, globalised union movement would be better than the thing we have now, I have no reason to argue with you. I can't see the future very clearly. I am just commenting on what exists at the moment.
This. Employee protection is needed but unions are yesterday's answer to tomorrow's problem. And no, I don't know what the better answer is.
Nothing is perfect and certainly not unions but they do still have relevance despite the Tory government making it as hard as possible. Not least the backing of union solicitors when necessary. Even to take an employer to a tribunal costs money for a solicitor which the poor paid in the community can’t afford and employers know this and exploit it. If so many in this day were not told unions are so bad they would have the backing when they need it
Good and bad people on all sides. We can all pick out both from both sides of the fence. I know an employer from a zero hours company with no unions who happily sacks anyone he wants when he wants and doesn’t pay out their final wage banking on them being unable to fight for it and many don’t.
Of course they serve their members, that’s the point. Of course in many places non union employees are happy to enjoy the benefits gained by the unions without paying to be a member and criticising the unions at the same time.
Good points and show the difficulties unions have but whilst far from perfect they are the organisation needed although modern ways do make it difficult.
They are all we have at the moment and if people stopped bleating and got involved then they could contribute to making the changes necessary
When trade union leaders are photographed ‘working’ on a Caribbean beach at the expense of the union is doesn’t sit well with the common man methinks. I remember this happening a few years ago. There are also examples of people’s subs being frittered away on inrcessary salaries and ‘golden handshakes’. All these things do is distance the leaders from the common worker... https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....s/2011/jul/18/unite-leader-golden-goodbye-row https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....ning-more-than-theresa-may-prime-minister/amp http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2176250/The-36-union-fat-cats-picking-100k.html
I would have no problem with my union membership fees going towards union solicitors fees, salaries for full-time union representatives etc and even government lobbying for improved working practices and HSE standards. However what I don't like is part of those fees going towards donations to the Labour Party without my say-so. Do individual members have the option to opt out of party donations?
I had a look at my history and it's funny when you look back, I was thinking about the late 70's and all those unionists who thought they had the country by the throat, they created such a situation that they brought down the Labour Government and guess what they got Thatcher, then I looked back at the 80's and how Scargill destroyed the NUM because of his political hatred towards Thatcher, again he thought he could repeat the trick and bring down the government, he just completely underestimated the woman in charge. You know what's really funny is that we have in some ways a rerun of that period, female Tory PM, ultra left wing leader of the Labour Party and unions again run by extremely politically motivated leaders who want to bring down a democratically elected government, the Labour Party again is being infested by the extremists as well, funny thing history.
Ah right. The old look at the seventies argument to show how bad unions are. Undoubtedly in that period the unions had the upper hand and abused it. What gets conveniently forgotten in that argument is that people have been working for employers for hundreds of years where employers have had the upper hand and certainly abused it. Hundreds v maybe twenty. Not such a good argument. When I said look at your history I meant all of it not just twenty years or so. Nowadays we have safer better paid jobs with better hours and holidays all due to unions not given out of the goodness of employers hearts and that’s just scratching the surface.
Yes they do. That’s been allowed for years. It originally existed as essentially the Labour Party was formed by union men and in those days formed the likes of the NHS and the welfare system although the Labour Party now sadly is often a different animal
