Off Topic The Politics Thread

Anyway…we were told by some there wasn’t gonna be an invasion…..and it was us in the know talking rubbish.

 

I obviously didn't mean troops on the ground just from the UK mate.
Although, as you well know, there are certain areas where we still lead the world.
I meant does anyone think Nato should put troops on the ground?
I think that's just too risky and could lead to massive escalation in a World scale.
As you say, if Putin invades a Nato country then we'll have no choice other than to go in (Nato, not just us!!).
I'm now fearful that Putin has gone over the edge, meaning all bets are off.

 

Still waiting to hear your opinion of what the West should do Col ?

Might have to wait till later for me to see as I’m off to bed. Was a busy night of CPR which bizarrely worked.
I’ve eaten a cake to celebrate

 

Ok mate.
As I say, you saying we'll do "**** all" came across as a criticism. Apologies if I got that wrong.
Not sure anyone on here has suggested that we (Nato) should put troops into Ukraine.
I certainly don't think we should.

The UK has been at the forefront in helping Ukraine though. Without doubt, we would have had "special advisers" there for many weeks and we've supplied a lot of kit.

For me, we now need to carry out the hardest sanctions possible, although I'm wary of causing too much hardship to ordinary Russians, who aren't to blame for any of this.

 

Whilst some of us suggested that the intelligence was clear that an invasion was highly likely.

 

Good answer Col.

 

I would say you and me were in that category mate…..some others, who obviously aren’t as well informed as us, seemed to doubt us

 

Here's a worrying scenario. One of Ukraine's effective weapons are drones - cheap and effective bought from Turkey. Obviously, drones can be operated from afar, and will need to be increasingly, as the Russian Army occupies Ukraine. Unlike Afghanistan where the Russian's were beaten, Ukraine is flat and doesn't have obvious ambush points - so the drone is a blessing. But suppose Ukraine Resistance operates them from Poland or one of the other NATO countries? This is how the war could escalate.

 

There are many ways this can go tits up mate.

What happens if one of our 'special advisers' is captured?

Cyber war is the next stage and will get very bad imo.

 

I don’t think any of us want innocent/ordinary Russians to suffer but if a bigger tide of resistance to Putin is to happen - and potentially cause his demise in whatever fashion that might be - do you not think this is necessary fallout of the sanctions.

 

Probably, yes.

 

Presumably it would be difficult for the Russian's to prove what the "special advisor" was doing. The Russians used the same tactic with men in green uniforms in Domblas. They were in fact Russian military in disguise.

I think the drone thing could well be an issue, because drones are small and devastatingly effective. I agree with you the next phase is cyber warfare, and in that respect, it all seems to be coming one way, from Russia to the West. I hope we are hitting back but it's just not reaching our media.

Of the Russian population, your average working Russian seems to be buying Putin's line that this is all a temporary incursion to protect fellow Russian's in Domblas etc. It's the Russian intelligentsia who have access to the internet that see things in perspective and are objecting

 

Champions League final moved to Paris, so UEFA showing their disapproval. Seeing scenes of tanks driving through Kiev is both surreal, horrible and heartbreaking for those innocent people who live there.

 

This is the beginning of the end for Putin. Listening to a Ukrainian yesterday saying this is the 21st Century and not some cold war past. Peoples minds have changed. 50 demonstrations in Russia and 1800 arrests. In the US and UK Russian and Ukraine flags flying side by side. He has underestimated this, which will be his downfall. I could go on about the EU but that will be for another day. Germany and Italy holding up the SWIFT question was is quite sad.
However the Russian people may have to suffer before the kick this gangster out.

 

Beat you.
I raise a glass for those poor souls in the Ukraine and alike.

 

I pose this hypothetical question:
Russia enters Ukraine & takes control
China is looking at Taiwan looking to take control

Then how long will Boris wait to invade Scotland to get the Calcutta cup back

 

You reckon Chelsea are guarding the European Cup?

 

Good post, but the quoted bit is the dilemma. For sanctions to work, they need to hurt the whole Russian economy, with the aim of crippling, or better yet even toppling, Putin from the inside. How we do that without causing hardship for ordinary Russians is beyond me.

There was a good article in The Times calling for al private schools in England/USA/beyond to expel every Russian student - you can't expect a comfortable Western education if your country is invading sovereign nations etc etc. The sort of thing that would get the richer classes agitated. Terribly unfair on the 12 year old kid that hasn't done anything wrong, but the sort of effective measure we should be looking at.

 

They are going to be stripped of the CL wins because they were won with Russian Money

 

Agreed.
It seems impossible not to harm ordinary Russians whilst achieving the aim of ousting Putin.
As you say, it needs to come from within.

A long, scary road ahead.