The problem is that these people aren't rioting because of rising fuel bills etc. These are just mindless thugs, tramps, thieves who are pathetic.
Yep. This ain't an angry protest to further some cause, this is kids wanting a bit more of the consumerism they get rammed down their throat daily and reckoning on being entitled to helping themselves to a piece of it. One of them was heard to comment "we want our taxes back man". Fact is, none of these little ****s has ever paid taxes in their life!
Yeah i no, it gives youths a bad name, even worse than what they have already got. I agree in principle to protest but there is no need to be burning peoples cars,houses and buisiness. This country is well and truly going down the s*****r at the moment and there isn't anybody with enough balls to say 'enough is enough, lets sort this mess out' camerons a tool and has NO idea how to control what is going on.
All the wind and rhetoric pouring out of the politicians mouths is completely nauseating. All they're interested in doing is repeating the old, tired lines of "how brave and courageous our police men & women have been". "We must bring the guilty to justice". NOBODY has stopped to ask the reason WHY this all blew up in the first place!!!!
It's far deeper than just the Police and Politicians. Somehow we have to find simple (not simplistic) answers as to what this country is all about. What the purpose of our economy is? Is it for the wellbeing of ALL of the people or is it a mechanism for the enrichment of the few? Now I'll freely admit that I am a socialst but I believe in a mixed economy (if you can earn a pile by your own efforts - good luck to you). But I truly believe that we must value social capital in the same way that we now value financial capital. Until we ensure that the people of this country have access to valued productive work we have no hope of solving any of these crisies. As for these rioters. They are thugs and robbers and should be dealt with accordingly. But underlying that, they have been created by a system that is rotten to the core.
But these people have to work hard for it. As does anyone. The people in the council estates expect the government to provide for them. These people should provide for their country! As I mentioned before, to stop these people from committing crime, they need to have good values and morals - this all stems from the parents. Parents to need to take responsibility and educate their children. I don't buy all this nonesense - 'we're living on an estate, surrounded by crime, i havene't got anything to do with my life so i won't bother going to school etc'. Instill them with the right values and morals, and they will work hard to achieve success.
You have to understand that there may be a fair few people rioting who have had a good upbringing with parents who have educated their children. You cannot blame these riots on how the kids have been brought up but on how society as a whole has rapidly decreased in the last 10 years.
having been raised on a council estate I cannot agree with you. My parents taught me right from wrong, that you had to earn your money and that you repsected everybody for who they are and not what they are. They both worked all their lives and expected me to do the same. But there was never any doubt that they loved me - even when I tested them! The values that you call for I believe can only come from from the parents. Whilst it is unfashionable to say so nowadays, I believe that they are essentially religious values. Now I would say that my values are essentially christian but from the little that I know the same type of values are estemmed by all of the major faith groups. Unless you can respect yourself then you have no ability to respect others. I call for more productive and valued work because if you deprive people of the means of earning a living then you take away a major part of their ability to build confidence and respect in themselves. How can a boy (or girl) watch a ship going down a slipway and have pride in saying "I helped build that" in this country? How can a man say "I'm the best whatever in this firm"? How can a ffather say "I hate this job but it's providing the means for my kids to have a better future" when all they are being offered is 20 hours in some retail shed where nobody gives a monkey's about them?
I think, dave, it is much too simplistic to relate things to religion. I was brought up a catholic but rejected it in my teens. I don't believe the teachings of any religion anymore, but I still hold to what are usually referred to as "christian" values. Both bad and good deeds are carried out by believers and agnostics alike. Thatcherism instilled a philosophy of greed and selfishness and the belief in a right to pursue ones own ends regardless of the broader consequences. The ideals of collective social responsibility were set back decades and have never really recovered the ground they seemed to hold in the sixties.
Forgive the pun saint but I think we are singing off the same hymnsheet here. I do recognise the failings of all faiths as they are presently demonstrated. But like you I was refering to what we call 'christian' values and i believe would also be claimed by Hindus, Muslims, Seeks and Agnostics. As for your 2nd paragraph, I am in total agreement with you.
Let's face it in the ****ed up capitalist society this country 'prides' itself on riots will always happen. The country needs to look at the basic structure of policies before any chance of such problems re-occurring. Whether or not we like it, the problem has been brewing for ages and this is just the outcome of a country that ****'s on the poor. The kids that have a very bleak future, have no other way to express their feelings. No-one will listen to them so you can't blame them for this situation. People that think it is the kids fault in my opinion are living in a very sheltered bubble and really need to wake up and realise what is happening to this ****ed up country. The youth are just making a stand - and unfortunately this is the only way that people will actually listen. They have exhausted every other avenue with absolutely no success. Fair play to them in my opinion.
Get a grip mate,according to the news channels last night he was shot dead by armed police officers who wrongly claimed he fired the 1st shot. If the news channels got their facts wrong fair enough but just like you i was'nt there and rely on others for information.
Great. All we have to do now is agree the need of a CB and we'll have nothing to argue about. Suddenly footie seems so much simpler again.
How many of the rioters that smashed London up earlier this year were from council estates?. The so called educated student population did'nt have many "values and morals" did they when they attacked buildings,war memorials and members of the royal family,Your sweeping comment about people from council estates is pure bollox,I live close to the new "private" estates of Croxteth Park and theres more criminals in the brand new houses there than there are in Walton Jail.
If he did'nt fire the 1st shot and he was'nt carrying a firearm but was shot dead he's innocent right? Or can armed police shoot unarmed people and remain innocent?
But that isn't the debate is it? He WAS armed (as far as i'm aware news wise - like we've said no one actually knows apart from the officers there and the deceased) I thought the thing getting questioned is whether he actually shot at them with the gun which was originally why the officers said they 'returned' fire. No one knows what actually went on, if he is waving a gun about and the police get itchy fingers and pop one off - I say fair play I would have done the same, your life or his right?
The way its been reported he was sitting in a mini cab,he was not armed and could'nt have fired the first shot at the police. And as MFG pointed out the Menezes case shows that "itchy fingered" police officers do get it wrong from time to time.
