Off Topic Political Debate

So the logic of the eurocrats: ok, having a democratic vote is fine as long as the result can be rigged to achieve the outcome of one side.

The current leaders in North Korea and Russia would support your ideas.

 

As always you have answered absolutely nothing in the text.

 

This point is constantly being made over here by those who were excluded by the 15 year rule. The government committed to changing it, but didn't.

On another point, yesterday the Northern Ireland NHS minister addressing the assembly suggested that they could be forced into joining their system with the one in the south. I am not sure how this would go down with the DUP who wanted to leave the EU, but it could create new tensions over there. I still have not heard a single explanation about how the border issue can be dealt with. It is fine for those already living in both the north and south because they can hold two passports by right, but how can the border be policed. During the height of the troubles it was shown to be impossible to stop people crossing it.

 

It must now be considered odds on that Theresa May will be the next PM. To ensure Tory Party unity a Brexit candidate will be deputy. I think that Gove has damaged his chances so it could well be another woman, Andrea Leadsom who had a brilliant campaign.
Who is doing the washing up and hoovering while these woman are not at home?

 

You're an idiot.

 

The poster is really a waste of time... one inflammatory remark after another... what possesses someone to behave in that way is beyond me.... .

I wonder if he is another poster in disguise actually.....

 

There is a distinct lack of humour on this forum.

 

Isn't your first sentence rather contradictory? You say that NZ wants to screw the UK over and is in a position to screw the British and flood the UK with Dairy and Sheep products - would you not think that they would need to negotiate a trade agreement that both sides believes is advantageous? If they sit at the table and say we are going to dump out products on your market, what do you think the response will be? Probably "no thanks, we already produce more milk than we can use"
I really do wonder if anyone on here has ever had to negotiate with a supplier before.

 

Children now get passports straight after they are born if they need them, why restrict to 16-18 year olds? why pick that line. Why should UK citizens living in other parts of the world be asked, it has no impact for them and there was a reasonable line drawn if they could vote. I am very sure that EU citizens living in the UK will have a number of choices after the full Brexit is implemented that means no change for them - same as for non-EU citizens.
You just make it up as you go along

 

How is it going for that bank that was going to move to Paris within 2 weeks? - only 1 week left to move those thousands of employees?
That bank in Singapore - did I read it was for investors in property in London?

 

Why should a EU national who has lived in the UK for forty years be denied a vote?

I see that Gove is now saying that he doesn't expect there to be any movement this year? Long grass is still growing.

Regarding the bank seeking office space, it has been taken. Confirmed now that it is HSBC. Others looking in Germany and Ireland.

Yes, it is for commercial office space. All outside money coming to the UK I would have thought.

Would you like to address the NI border question? Seems that the NI assembly is concerned even if it is not thought possible to come up with a one liner from the Leave campaign.

 

HSBC chairman Douglas Flint said "The message to staff is strategy hasn't changed, no change in roles or prospects as of today"

He also said " The UK now has the chance to rewrite some of the rules governing firms for the better. We are going to have the best regulation in the world"

Barclays Bank Jes Staley said "The bank is staying anchored in Great Britain and is not making any plans to move staff on to the continent" He also said " You might have to increase your presence in another location - that does not mean you have to decrease at your location here"

Poor OFH and others are desperate to find some negative news but reality is making it very difficult. Oh well - keep trying.

 

Would you like to comment on the rest on the post seeing as you didn't understand what HSBC and Barclays are saying.?

 

You have been inferring that there will be some kind of exodus from the City of London. The comments from the heads of Barclays and HSBC clearly show this is not the case.

Rather than just read the silly headlines you prefer you should actually find out what is going on.

 

You really are talking through your anulus W_Y. Has no impact on them ! It has an impact on every person carrying a British Passport because it changes their legal status in the country they are in. Everything which changes a person's legal status without them having a choice in the matter is a violation of democracy. There are lawyers working on this theme at the moment, so that may be the first of many challenges which Brexit has - was the referendum carried through legally - the government said it would allow all ex pats to vote but didn't. This is the first of many challenges and hurdles before you can start talking about Brexit, the next obstacles:

1. Parliament has to vote on this, either to ask for a second referendum or to simply ignore the result - many are saying now that it is unthinkable to not carry into effect what the electorate wanted, but what else can they say ? Many things can change in 2 months, to the economy, also through actually analysing the difficulties of Article 50 (and how one sided it is), through seeing how many English people actually regret their decision etc. etc.

2. It then has to go through the House of Lords (which cannot reject it, but can delay).

3. It is a major constitutional change which could well involve the breakup of the UK. It has to have the agreement of the Queen (the Royal prerogative has not been used in recent history but it is still there) although protocol says that the Queen does not interfere with politics, this is not just a political question - and now might just be the time.

4. Scotland. The disestablishment of EU. law in Scotland needs the agreement of the Scottish Parliament - Westminster could only circumvent this by tearing up the devolution treaties - in this case Scotland would go (and Scotland does not need the agreement of Westminster to call a second referendum in this latter case). Scotland alone would have to apply for membership of the EU. but, even allowing for waiting time, this would be at least a light at the end of the tunnel. Scotland could get in quicker, but this would involve one existing member state in effect standing bail for it (as when the GDR joined as part of Germany). The lack of a separate currency is also not a problem - their currency is tied to the pound, but the currency of Luxembourg was tied to that of Belgium when they came in.

5. Then there is Article 50 itself - there is much question being made about whether it is reversible or not. The truth is it doesn't say (it's only 250 words long) and the absence of this info. leads some lawyers to one conclusion and others to a different one. There is, however, no mechanism by which a nation can be thrown out of the EU. and so the assumption is that it is reversible during the 2 year negotiation period, but not afterwards.

6. All the negotations, from the British side, and any votes on which laws to accept and which to reject, would be carried through with a majority of MPs, and representatives, who were for remaining in the EU. so what comes out the other end is going to be very very different to what the Brexiters were hoping for and promising.

The action of repeating a referendum is not in any way undemocratic. Judges ask juries to go back and reconsider their verdicts on many occasions - is that undemocratic ? Also many governments ask for second elections when a mandate was either too complicated, or unworkable. You say I have always asked for direct democracy, ok. but a sudden introduction of it into a system which is used to representative democracy is dangerous, because people use it to demonstrate about everything they don't like - it leads to a simple anti establishment vote. Countries like Switzerland have safety mechanisms such as only 50% of the whole electorate can decide changes in law, and they also have mechanisms ensuring that a vote must be evenly spread through the country to be valid.

 

OK once again you show yourself up as not wishing to even attempt to answer a straight forward question. I wonder how many times that is now.

 

Rather than posting inaccurate silly scare stories surely you have some shutters that need rubbing down?

Fortunately the UK has an abundance of experienced entrepreneurs that will take advantage of the UK's freedom from the straightjacket of the EU. You really should be concerned with the rapid deterioration and decline of France's prospects.

 

The debate here is not about France....if you keep going on this track I will start talking about Germany the whole time. You could say that Germany is only strong now because it rejected all those calls from the Anglo Saxon world to liberalize its economy in the 90s. Had it gone the same way as the UK. it would now not be in a position to bale out anyone. The fact that some markets have temporarily stabilized is because they have realized (in contrast to what Cameron promised) that Brexit is not going to happen for quite some time (if at all).

 

Germany have done well because they joined the Euro at a very advantages rate and because of the agreement the German government had with the unions to not let German manufacturing rates become uncompetitive.

I quote the dire future of France because of OFH's ridiculous rubbishing of the UK's prospects. I appreciate legitimate concerns but it does nobody any good people like him and you talking the UK down.

The markets are stabilising because the UK's long term prospects are good once freed of the unnecessary bureaucracy of the EU. The markets, unlike you realise the decision is final.

 

Drat - the nasty equivalent of the Tories in Australia are inching towards victory in the GE there. Sometimes I wonder what goes through people's minds when confronted with a ballot paper...

http://www.abc.net.au/news/federal-election-2016/results/