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Not fulfilling our 'obligations'!?

Discussion in 'Norwich City' started by Walsh.i.am, Apr 9, 2013.

  1. Walsh.i.am

    Walsh.i.am Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    We all know what a ****-stirring bastard he is and how he despises all things yellow and green, but here's his latest column for the Daily Fail - what an apt liaison, tailor made for each other <doh>

    It's highlighted in a pale green box about halfway down. Does he have a point about us and Stoke failing to fulfill our "obligations" by not providing a brand of 'entertainment'?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...r-United-haters-Paul-Lambert-Aston-Villa.html

    And, let's not go down the 'shoot the messenger' route, I unfollowed Talkshite and everyone connected with it (Collymore excepted) on twitter ages ago <ok>
     
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  2. Pablofarmer

    Pablofarmer Active Member

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    entitled to his opinion.
    think he should maybe look at his own team first.
     
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  3. gorlestongirl

    gorlestongirl Member

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    He is saying what a lot of NCFC fans are saying. Where I disagree with him, and these others, is that I see resolute defending as an important part of the game; a well timed fair and hard last ditch tackle is an essential element of the English game, and I am proud that we have two top rate proponents of this in Bassong and Turner. And if that results in clean sheets against some of the top teams and strikers in the League; with a winning goal on the counter attack, then I am over the moon.

    Durham is garbage; his use of the English language is as poor as his understanding of our game.
     
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  4. Home on the range canary

    Home on the range canary Well-Known Member

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    Football is a business, therefore any legal way of achieving success is permitted. We are building a team, and it is probable that there will be improved quality to the side next year, so in sum the bloke is fecking clueless
     
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  5. canary_max

    canary_max Well-Known Member

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    he set his stall out on us over Xmas and has to be consistent. i doubt he has seen many of our games either.
    let's just prove him wrong Cromer.
     
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  6. Norfolkbhoy

    Norfolkbhoy Well-Known Member

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    The bloke makes his living by trying to stoke up controversy. If you don't like it then don't read it and certainly don't buy the paper.

    I can see his point about our style of play post Christmas but football is first and foremost a results business. Just ask Blackpool's fans whether they would rather have played a bit tighter and still be in the PL or be in the Championship having had to sell off their best players? For all of his tactical faults CH inherited a pretty weak (by Prem standards) squad with a leaky defence. He has prioritised addressing our defensive frailties and by and large suceeded - I doubt anyone would argue that we are defensively weaker this year compared to last. The flip side is that we have sacrificed style and creativity. Hopefully stage 2 of project Norwich will involve us signing better quality players capable of giving us more attacking options without losing the defensive solidity. the signing of the Wolf is a good statement of intent and i reckon we are only a couple of players away from having a really good side.
     
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  7. YorkieLancsHampyLondoner

    YorkieLancsHampyLondoner Well-Known Member

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    Load of old bollocks - it's a lazy way to fill column inches, take no notice.
     
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  8. 1950canary

    1950canary Well-Known Member

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    We would be a couple of players away from having a side capable of staying in the Premiership for another year especially with the lack of quality likely to come up from the Championship this year. The days have long gone when a Club our size ends up with a really good side.
     
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  9. Norfolkbhoy

    Norfolkbhoy Well-Known Member

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    I don't know. I suppose it depends on your definition of realy good. I see really good for Norwich as a top half finish with the occasional flirtation with a UEFA cup place and progress in the cups. I reckon if the Wolf is as good as he looks we will have him, Ruddy, Bassong, Turner, Snodgrass and Tetty as pretty damn good PL players and I reckon we not seen the best of Whittaker, Howson or Butterfield so I think that this is the basis for a pretty good PL side for a club of our stature. Maybe I am just being a bit optimistic but I can see us progressing and I don't think that it will take as much as some people think for us to be much more of a force than we currently are.
     
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  10. Canary Rob

    Canary Rob Well-Known Member

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    I don't think you're being optimistic, I generally agree. Although I wouldn't say Turner "is pretty damn good" - I'd classify him as reliable (definitely Prem class), but not quite the same level as Bassong. I think Pilks could be if he manages to shake off injuries for an extended period of time and find some consistent form, so I'd throw him into the mix.
     
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  11. Walsh.i.am

    Walsh.i.am Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    I'd be really surprised if we don't sign a quicker left sided mid in summer and Pilks has to play second fiddle to whoever it may be. Plus I assume Surman has played his last for us, along with Tierney and Fox?
     
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  12. Dangerous Marsupial

    Dangerous Marsupial Well-Known Member

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    I actually found that mildy amusing to read. Either he purposely comes up with wild opinions in the hope some people notice him (It is ironic that he is critical Joey Barton for this) or he is just extremely bitter about same great wrong we have committed against him in the past.
     
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  13. Norfolkbhoy

    Norfolkbhoy Well-Known Member

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    Yep - I can definitely see a quicker LM coming in over the Summer. I really like Pilkington and on his day he is superb but unfortunately he does not have enough on days and is a bit injury prone. I think that it is noticeable how much better Snodgrass's workrate is so that even if he is not having a blinder he is still contributing. I think that too often Pilks goes missing for long periods in games. I can see there being a number of Lambert-era departures come the summer.
     
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  14. Home on the range canary

    Home on the range canary Well-Known Member

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    Pilkington is on course to screw up a very promising career. he needs to start putting a shift in, when he gets the chance otherwise he will fail to fulfil his undoubted potential
     
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  15. Canary Rob

    Canary Rob Well-Known Member

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    Harsh, but possibly fair. As mentioned above, the struggle with injuries means it is difficult to get into the rhythm he had of November-December 2011, but I agree his work rate isn't always quite good enough and he can be anonymous
     
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  16. DHCanary

    DHCanary Very Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    In terms of the "on-pitch entertainment", we've maybe failed in this department for the last half a season, anything beyond that I'd say is probably harsh. Stoke on the other hand have played in an unattractive manner for several seasons, although Pulis did appear to be trying to change that earlier in the season. I think that maybe he's realised it hasn't worked as well as he'd hoped, tried to revert to the old tactics, but his signings for a "better style" aren't as effective in that manner.

    I, and I think many others, see the style at the moment as simply a means to an end, which is surviving this season so we can rebuild. Last season we had a group of players all desperate to prove something, all full of confidence, and with the right manager to continue to inspire and push them to greater and greater efforts. Lambert was the ideal man to over-achieve with the players he had. We also got lucky to some extent with injuries (losing Ruddy, Holt or maybe Martin would have been pretty difficult), and the poor board decisions of Blackburn, and arguably Wolves meant there were teams in turmoil for a long while, contributing to their downfall.

    This season is a bit more transitional, the change of manager is one thing, and whilst I fully support Hughton, he's not the motivator that Lambert was, so perhaps some players have failed to hit the heights of last season, and others have struggled with form and injuries more. Last summer, Hughton brought in a higher calibre of defensive players, but by having his preferred formation, and a lack of squad depth in the positions "new" to our squad, injuries, tiredness and loss of form of individuals hits us a lot harder than before. We've really only got 2 tough-tackling DM's on our books, and with a formation that needs 2, cover has been limited to Howson, who's out of position, and that also removed competition/cover for Hoolahan. We've got 3 wingers, with 2 playing each week. Pilks' struggles have therefore created issues in that area. Tierney has been so out of form we've really only got 1 recognised LB in the squad. Up front we're also perhaps the weakest in the division.

    Of course questions can be asked of Hughton: Why stick with a formation we're struggling to have the players for? Why is Fox of the picture entirely after signing a new deal? Why are subs coming so late? (Possibly addressed below) Why sign Becchio and not use him? Whether there's logical reasons for these or not, all managers have their preferences, and make seemingly odd (to us) choices, but if results are ok they get away with it. If we go down, or similar questions are being asked next year, then I'll be pressing more for answers, or a managerial change. I'm giving Hughton time for now.

    I think come the summer, we'll still just about be a PL side, and Hughton will look to rebuild. We've already signed a class act up front, with supposedly 2 wingers coming in to challenge for starting positions, and an attacking midfielder to push Hoolahan. I think we'd all be surprised not to see a significant DM sign, which puts pressure on Johnson+Tettey, and frees up Howson to be further competition for Wessi. Garrido should be signing permanently, and another LB in perhaps Olsson, will provide cover and competition there. The continued links to Davies suggests cover for Turner and Bassong is inbound. From next season, we should then, finally, have the personnel to play Hughton's formation well. The players coming in are likely to be of a higher calibre, but there are also likely to be more names on the bench that Hughton trusts to make a difference.

    Take our bench against Swansea: Camp, Whittaker, R Bennett, Fox, Tettey, Holt, Becchio. Camp had to come on, but beyond that, who would really have changed the game for us? At 2-1 up, Tettey is really the only one Hughton could have brought on. Not knowing how fit he actually is, I can forgive Hughton for not risking Tettey earlier, if he'd pulled up after Howson/Hoolahan was removed, you're left with either Whittaker playing an unusual position or Fox to step up after 2 months on the sidelines. Next season we could have, for example, Kamara to come on and bully defences, but with the pace to scare them too, or a fully-fit Johnson/Tettey/AN Other DM to shore things up. Perhaps a pacy, tricky winger to give a full-back a fresh hell for 20 minutes.

    Back to the OP, I think (and hope) the style is temporary. You could argue though that all football clubs are businesses, and results are more important than style though. Hopefully next season we'll have both.
     
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  17. Home on the range canary

    Home on the range canary Well-Known Member

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    I imagined that he would have 3-4 good seasons, (injuries excepted) and that a big team would come knocking for his services, it is a little difficult to see that happening, but it still could
     
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  18. 1950canary

    1950canary Well-Known Member

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    Which is precisely why we will never have a ' really good side ' or challenge for a top half finish. If we ever got a team together which over performed the bigger boys would come knocking on our door for our best players and due to the fee offered to us and/or the wages offered to the player the team would break up. Far better supported Clubs than ours have been forced to sell players they wanted to keep - how many good players have Everton, Villa etc been forced to sell in those circumstances? Even Arsenal, whose wage structure is probably 4 or 5 times greater than ours, have been forced to sell players they wanted to keep. It is a sorry fact of life - a bigger Club than ours loses their best player to an even bigger Club and looks around smaller Clubs for a replacement.
     
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  19. ilovedelia

    ilovedelia Well-Known Member

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    Is this the same bloke who wrote a whole load of lies about Delia during the promotion celebration at City hall?
    If it is he got a few F***'s from me in reply at the time! Someone has already said that he doesn't watch us play, well that may or may not be true but he certainly wasn't at City hall that afternoon, and he was told so in no uncertain terms.
     
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  20. DHCanary

    DHCanary Very Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    I don't think that's necessarily true, look at West Brom. Beyond Lukaku (who isn't theirs anyway) and perhaps Mulumbu, there aren't many players being touted as moving on to bigger things. Next season the majority of their squad from this season will still be together. I'd also rather see our players leave to bigger and better things, with us getting a healthy transfer fee, than be signing over-the-hill players and loanees. <whistle>
     
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