Hi guys, long time viewer first time poster - Just seen all the slagging off of Fonte thats been going on after the united game, and whilst i agree with what seems to be popular opinion that Hoover's a much better and more aware footballer, looking at today's game and the city game I dont think Jos has got the right mindset for this league, he seems out of his depth (marking Tevez far too tight for that penalty two weeks ago, then the madness we saw today to give Utd their penalty..) Sure Jose doesnt have as much ability, but Jos unnerves me a lot more than he does and against the lesser teams than Utd and City I think Fonte's slightly more calming influence might tell (if Yoshida comes into the starting 11, which for me he's got to on the strength of our current defence). Hats off to the team though, never expected to come close today, so feeling so angry and disappointed at the result has to be testament to just how well they did, just hope 0pts doesnt have too big an effect on morale. Lambert and Lallana incredible again, Puncheon surprisingly much improved too. I wanna just hear what people think about this, seeing as we only have 3 centre backs who are realistically (when fit) competing with each other atm, who would you play? Joe
I'd have to see Yoshida. Seaborne has been out so long I would have to see him at this level to make a judgement. Fonte let RVP go for the winner but like you say, Hoover went a bit crazy for the pen. Fonte is a smarter player and I think I would just about put Hooiveld ahead of him so depends on Yoshida's ability.
On the three games so far, Fonte looks better than Hooiveld. I agree Hooiveld loks out of his depth. I think with a better centre-half alongside him Fonte would shine.
I think it's just a gigantic learning curve - the largest you can get - for a newly-promoted defence. Defenders will almost always be the ones making the visible mistakes, and we have played two TV games against two of Europe's best defences. Look at Man City when they stepped up to the CL last season and failed - watch their CL defensive errors in the group stages this season. We haven't got the best defence, I agree, but what would anyone expect after the games we played? I think they should be judged on how they apply their experience after this international break - luckily, they won't have any international duty, so Nigel will be making sure those errors are trained out of them. I have no excuse for Fonte's mistake against Wigan, though...
Hooiveld has been a bit clumsy the last few games, but you can't forget that he was an absolute rock last season-he was our second best player last year IMO. Fonte did a lot of errors last season and he doesn't look like he's learned from them either. He lacks composure, probably due to the fans always getting on his back-oh, and he needs to grow his hair again! Hooiveld > Fonte, but I hope Yoshida's better than both of these two.
admittedly i didnt manage to see the wigan game but yeah i heard it was a shocker. theyll have to bed down fast, its the confidence after shipping 3 2 and 3 goals that im worried about! be interesting to see seabourne again after his injury, always rated him before it but he doesnt seem to be pushing JF and JH yet..
I would remind people that Tevez & van Persie will cause most defenders problems. Look how highly regarded most of the Chelsea defenders are viewedbut Falcao & co made them look ameteurish on Friday.
its not ability im on about, its mentality - the only reason hooiveld conceded those penalties were because of poor positioning (man city) cz he didnt think about it and because of sheer lunacy (today). ive got no problem with the guys ability, if his heads on straight he's great but i seem to remember this is why celtic wanted rid. i think fonte should be cut a little slack as it seems to be him that attracts all the criticism
Hi JR and welcome. Hopefully you've been viewing long enough to know that it goes a bit loony after a defeat however well we played, but normal service will be resumed shortly... The question is really whether 3 CBs is not enough, or 4 is too many. If we brought in another one it would mean that Seaborne is doing nothing, and we have 1 good CB who is going to rarely get a look in. After all we only had 3 last year and that went pretty well, more games played too, so Seaborne probably won't be called upon unless in an emergency. Would be interesting to know how many CBs other teams have, but as MOTD2 is about to start I can't be bothered to find out. Anyway if it's not working out by January then Nigel can do something about it with plenty of the season left to go.
Yeah I think Fonte has been better than Hooiveld this season, but neither get a particularly glowing recommendation. Hooiveld has been let off twice by penalty misses. I don't know nearly enough about Yoshida to comment on his skills in comparison but I suppose we'll find out soon enough.
cheers qwerty (y) yeah i've kind of gathered that haha cant believe all the anger knocking around on here tonight..
It's obvious our manager rates one of them enough to keep them in until at least January , well people know my views on it .
Last season it was clear that Hooiveld was something of a revelation. He came in, on loan, and immediately solved our defensive problems, while Fonte was playing alongside and actually carrying an injury for much of the season. Against far better opposition, Fonte's much greater speed and mobility gives him the advantage over his teammate. Neither are going to get as much chance to attack as they did last season, so I don't expect many goals [if any] against their names, this time. It won't always be like this though. They are having a baptism of fire, and it won't stop at Arsenal either. It'll be a great learning curve, and I hope they are upto the task of becoming better for it..
Hooiveld = Celtic/SPL reject Fox = Celtic/SPL reject As for comparing the two centre backs , well at a push I would have Hooiveld in because he seems to have a bit more spacial awareness .
Neither of them are looking good enough at the moment, of the two I have more confidence that Jos will make the improvement and step up. Fonte has been playing short of his best for most of a year now and just doesn't look like cracking it. I hope I'm proven wrong on this but if not then the new boy had better be bloody good or we are going to struggle (at least until Jan).
Hoovield's frankly stupid sliding tackle from behind in the penalty area yesterday did it for me. I cannot recall, offhand, a more blatant penalty in a long time. If he was a youngster I would put it down to his age - but he can have no excuse whatsoever. He turned a containable situation into what should have been a sure-fire goal. It suggests that he is struggling with the pace of the game - physically and mentally. So if I had to chose to keep one over the other - it would be Fonte. That said, I do not think Fonte is anything more than a benchwarmer in the EPL. I am praying that Toshida is the real deal...
The hippies will go mental , 3 posts on the soon saying they are not happy with the defence , they have to admit Nigel has got all this wrong , Del Piero now , can we get a centre back at least one more and a left beck who will help bring and develop Shaw , all Fox is worried is that orange tan of his .
Jeez fella. The window is shut. That's it apart from a small number of un-contracted players. THE WINDOW IS SHUT..... we have what we have. We all know we need another defender at least, but it's too late now until January. I am sure that we were trying to get one, but we didn't succeed, so, just incase you weren't aware ..... we can not sign anyone until January.
