I thought instead of more Hughes bashing (for which I have been guilty of in anger!), I thought we could look at what he can do to set things right! In essence we do have a quality side.....all it takes it tweaking and re-jigging...something Hughes seems to be taking his time doing, but if he can get it right then we can start to move up where we belong! His record since he joined us in January is - P28 Won 8 Drawn 4 Lost 16 - that is a win ratio of 28%. For me after watching the last 2 games Reading and West ham and actually all the games beforehand we have been crying out for a CDM....someone to sweep up any through ball, long balls and break up counterattacks. So may times we have been attacking with the naturally slow Faurlin and Granero pushed up high with the wingers SWP and Park......the other team defends and counterattack us with ease.....Tottenham actually scored this way and this cost us even more points....this also leaves a huge gaping hole in the middle, which is why Nolan litterally bossed the centre for large parts of the match...totally dictating the play. Now for me Faurlin and Granero are luxury players when played in partnership.....they play some lovely stuff and I dont doubt their ability to create BUT having them both trying to the run the middle of the park, doesnt work....they arent fast/strong enough and cant possibly cover the CDM position as well as push forward and create chances.....this in turn leaves our frail defence hopelessly exposed. Bringing on Diakite showed what a difference that made last night.....a lot of blikered fans thought it was the bringing on of Tarbs.....yes he massivley bolstered our creativity and should be starting now.....but the big change for me was Diakite stopping them from playing through the middle. So this moves me onto our formation...this is what I feel we should be playing.....feel free to slate me or call me an idiot, but I believe if hughes moves over to this we will have more success. Below will be ideal defence based on injuries returning. ------------------------Cesar--------------------------- Bosingwa------Nelsen---------Ferdinand------------Fabio -----------------M'Bia or Diakite---------------------- ---------------Granero or Faurlin-------------------- --Hoilett--------------------------------Tarrabt---- -------------Cisse---------Zamora----------------- Park hasnt impressed me at all, mainly as he is being played out of position.....he could instead be on instead of Hoilett as he is our Captain (another major mistake) The Diamond in the middle gives us more stabilty in the middle and cover in front of the defence and Tarbs playing off Granero and Cisse will create goals. Would like to hear your thoughts and wether you think im completely wrong...........
Nice thread Frankster but you've got to throw into the mix that Bosingwa and Fabio are out for a while I understand and Diakite is now banned for 2 games Not sure when Ferdinand is due back but that is 3 of your back four out for West Brom and possibly longer. We need a formation to deploy this Saturday that will get us at least a point and hopefully off of the bottom
Yeah.....I know that, I believe its 1 game for 2 yellows?? Also that is my ideal team without Injury....but the formation remains the same. How long are Bosingwa and Fabio actually out for?...remember we have an internationl break coming up.
Sorry my mistake its one game isn't it. Not sure but I thout both Bosingwa and Fabio were medium term injuries whereas Ferdinand could be back sooner??
That formation would see us getting killed down the wings. we have to go to a 4231 and drop Cisse who was awful yet again. The 3 would be Park on the right, Taarabt in the middle and Hoilett on the bench with SWP in the SAR stand.
True....you would have to adpat for each game, but it something to start with. Also it would only see us getting killed down the wing if the oppositon played with fast wingers.....but in fairness we were getting done on the wing last night as well.
I'm going to mention Derry too. He did a job for us at times last season but seems to have become the forgotten man for some reason. I like your set up, Frankster but we can also play like we did at Tottenham or go 433. He has a lot of options. Now I've calmed down surely we'll soon be climbing the table.
Indeed.....there are other options/formations we can swap to...I didnt want to list them all as its good to see other opinions. But playing a midfield like this: -------Defense-------------- ------Big gaping Hole---------- ----Faurlin---granero----- SWP-----------------Park Is killing us!
Not wrong at all...... it's a nice idea. But we have to get away from the 4 at the back idea entirely, I think. We should play 3-5-2, which basically would look more like 5-3-2 when defending. It'll give us more width and a good squeeze cover in the middle at the back to always have that middle guy pushing it to the sides. Park on the right, Hoilett on the left, Taraabt would sit behind the strikers, and Granero-Faurlin behind him. As for the back 3, we'll do with what we have and they stay until the injured come back.
Frank, I understand what you're getting at. But we played this formation in our 'best' performances against Chelsea and Spurs 1st half. Why didn't it kill us then? Was it that the defense was a lot more solid than against Reading and WHU? Was it that all those 4 midfield players seemed to suffer a drop in form/confidence since the Spurs game? I actually think it's Cisse that is killing us at the moment more than anything, nowhere near his best
Well I didnt see the Chelsea game as I was on holiday, so I cant comment on that one. But that did cost us against Spurs.....Spurs were woeful in the 1st Half and were set out even worse than us.....(Bale at left back??) As soon as they changed it we couldnt handle them and they scored from a counterattck with no cover in that CDM. I agree with the point about Cisse....he actually looks like he cant be bothered! The point was that the formation he is using over and over isnt working and discussing what needs to be changed.
I am with you on most of this Frankster - I suggested this diamond midfield before the West Ham game. I think this or variations of it is the way too go. I go with most of the players though probably I'd choose Hill or M'bia as CB before Ferdinand. I agree entirely that Park and SWP don't warrant a place in the the starting 11, at least when most of our midfield players are fit. I think Cisse should play as much as possible, agree he's not at last season's best yet, but he still did far more than Zamora last night, and came closest to scoring for us. Zamora looked off the pace last night to me, certainly off our pace when Adel, Diakite, Hoillet, SWP and Cisse were all running at Hammers, Zamora seemed a very slow link. He's a good target man outlet I agree, but if we are playing at our fluent best which we saw just a glimpse of after Adel and Diakite came on, I am not sure if he's worth his place, particularly if Cisse gets back to top form.
The difference is we could just sit deep and have 2 banks of 4 and look solid. We dont have the ability when the onus is on us to try to win. Park Faurlin, Granero, SWP do not offer much in the way of an attacking threat, especially when up against 5 opposing midfielders. We are set up not to concede and try to nick a goal which is very negative. Wed have won if Hughes was positive but hes not.
The defence sorts itself out once the players are all back on deck. After last nights debacle, midfield/frontline has to be this for the forseeable future. Faurlin - Mbia/Diakite Taarabt - Granero - Hoilett Zamora But what I think is totally irrelevant because MH won't do the obvious.
and for the next game. Faurlin - Granero Park - Taarabt - Hoilett Zamora Everyone in their 1st choice position, no chance of that happening though.
Yeah agree with that.....we have the cover in the defensive midfield role and Hoilett and Tarbs will create the goals with Zamora holding it up for them.
Good point, Flyer - Park, especially was a square peg in a round hole. Yappy - 352 could work but we are so poor in transition. It's a big worry yhat we fail to adjust quickly enough to losing the ball and to winning it. We have no where near enough fluidity for 352 at the mo IMO. Nice to have a decent football thread by the way
------Diakite----Faurlin---- ---------Granero---------- Junior-----------------Adel --------Zamora/Cisse------ End of story
Formation conversation is a little "pointless" our strikers can't score and MH wants to ship DJ out. What if Zamora gets injured and Cisse picks up a RED. More points lost. MH - "Jamie - I want you to play right wing/full back and lone striker all at the same time", JM "OK boss I'll give it a go, but why?" MH - "because I'm a complete and utter prawn ball with no Idea how to build a balanced squad Jamie" JM - "Oh no not again....." This conversation is coming at some point this season and will be the point MH loses the dressing room. For the record and in case I've neglected to mention it, I would like to state MH has my total backing and confidence for the next 2 games. We need divine intervention IMO.
