Off Topic Political Debate

There's a difference between the various definitions of democracy and the practices we might claim are democratic or undemocratic. I suspect that your selection of what are democratic practices and mine may well be similar but they'll all be subject to qualifications which in the eyes of some won't make them undemocratic. Trying to clarify what is and isn't a democratic practice leads to using terms like 'relevant information' which is itself likely to be disputed.

 

I guess that it's her right to choose not to vote, as long as she is happy with the probable consequences. Quite a few Aussies agreed with her in this year's Election - the turnout, at just under 91%, was the lowest since 1925. So around 1.4 million citizens chose to receive the show-cause letter and face the $20 fine (or worse if they ignore the letter - $180 + court costs). A nice little earner for the government really. Around half that number took a different approach - turned up to vote but deliberately defaced the ballot paper, thereby avoiding the possibility of a fine.

I don't really see the point of your friend's stance - at the end of the day, none of us vote for any given personality, our vote goes to the 'Party Machine'. At least the Australian system allows you to vote against the party you like the least!!

 

After partial results it is clear that Francois Fillon has secured the Conservative ticket for next year's presidential elections by a wide margin.

I have been saying for over 20 years that France is desperate for a Margaret Thatcher type of politician to address the anti business culture. Well one of her disciples now has a chance to beat Le Pen to the presidency. This will pit a eurosceptic against an even more eurosceptic candidate. The question to be asked is whether the French electorate are sufficiently sophisticated enough to be told unpalatable truths and take the desperately required medicine.?

 

There was a referendum, yet again, for the Swiss today. This time it was the Greens trying to get a quick positive date for the closure of their nuclear power stations. With a third of their power coming from that source it could have been economic suicide to shut them down before they had something to replace them with. Anyway common sense won the day, and the power stations will continue to fuel the economy.

 

The Swiss have 5 active nuclear power stations - the Green suggestion was to have 3 of these closed in 2017 and the other 2 in 2029. This was balanced against the governments approximate plan of closing all stations by 2050, which appears rather imprecise. The issue was followed very carefully in Baden Württemberg because 2 of the oldest - AKW Beznau 1 and 2 are right up against the German border. The first of these is the oldest active nuclear power station in the World - in service since 1969.

 

Yes that was similar to my understanding of it. The trouble with the argument to close three next year was not practical as they do not have anything to replace them with next year.

 

It may have been a negotiating gambit Frenchie, to raise public awareness. The present plan appears far too imprecise and too long drawn out. It may be like market trading - I ask for 50 pounds and you offer 10 and we go from there. You can bet your life that there will be a second referendum within the next 10 years - they love referendums in Switzerland. The Greens there want that all nuclear power stations have a life span of no longer than 45 years - with no new ones being built. I cannot understand that this theme is not being discussed at the European level - in Germany they are being phased out, yet we have the oldest in Europe just the other side of the Swiss border, antiquated ones just over the border in Belgium (which have had accidents recently), and new ones being built in the Czech Republic.

 

As my Swiss friend tells me the referendums are a pain in the rear end. She also tells me that as a nation they are a bit more savvy than the Brits as they will not vote for something when they cannot see the plan and where it is leading.

 

Further to Fillon's stated aim to Thatcherite France can we assume the unions will shut down the country for a couple of years until he backs off, a la Sarkozy?

 

Apparently Theresa May tried to secure early agreement regarding the rights of EU citizens in the UK and Uk expats abroad. This was refused by Merkel in case they wanted to use our expats as a bargaining tool later on. This proves her stance on the issue was 100% correct.

 

This is not a wind up, honestly!!

The Conservatives have a near record lead in the polls over the Labour Party does anyone have any theories why, also the same is happening in many other European countries, again why?

 

I don't know, but with the partial breaking up of the European Union and a rise of the far right and attacks on minority groups, I do worry greatly for the future.

 

Conservative rule is like a bout of constipation, you just have to grin and bear it and know it will disappear sometime. I think the reason for the polls is that people are thinking the Conservatives got us into this mess now they have to find a way through it. How could Labour take over at the moment - could Corbyn activate article 50 ? Does anyone have any idea how Labour would negotiate Brexit ? It was not their thing in the first place. Unfortunately, Brexit has served as a distraction which has forced many other things down the agenda, and I think the polls reflect this.

 

Massive amount of Ex-lax required for most of Europe for the foreseeable future.

 

Is that because the electorate's that make these choices must be full of...

 

Our not beloved President has announced tonight that he will not seek re-election next year. He probably didn't wish to face up to being humiliated, something that was certain for the most unpopular incumbent on record.

 

Following all of this in my French class ( in French ) M Fillon looks as bad too in an opposite way.... there will be strike after strike if he gets in...

But more worryingly if the Socialists don't get their act together the run off will be between Le Pen and Fillon... and there is a chance France could lurch to the far right..... which would cause such divisiveness....

 

France is already runaway runners up in the European 'strike' championship. The excellent Fillon could make them European Champions in no time.

 

The Tory party has been beaten into second place in the Richmond by-election, losing a 20,000 plus majority. Goldsmith stood as an Independent with support coming from the Tories and UKIP, so despite the local issue of Heathrow expansion the people there put country first. I don't suppose the neighbouring MP will stick to her promise to fight Heathrow and stay in the EU. Maybe the mayhem we see from the PM should make her think again about putting her local electors first.

 

Mmmm interesting times and a fairy tale story for Sarah Olney who didnt even get into politics until 18 months ago and believes fervently in saying no to hard Brexit.............