Off Topic Political Debate

Do you really want me to answer this ? There is no such thing as democracy because the minute you say that you have it then it is not there. Democracy is like all things made by man - it is either growing or it is dying. It is a never ending process and not a finished product. A democracy cannot be a system where only the narrow political sphere is involved - it is a word which describes whole societies and not just politics. When the whole of a country's economic base is organized along democratic lines - its factories, its schools, its army etc. when the state has transferred all decision making processes to the base of the triangle. Pure democracy is nothing other than the completed form of Communism - where political parties are no longer the formers of political ideas, and where the populace has been educated to the point of being able to take over direct control. At least that's the dream - it will never be reachable in England (maybe not anywhere) but 'democracy' is an aim not a finished product. The minute people stop fighting for it then it is gone. But the best way to stop people fighting for something is to brainwash them into believing they have it already.

 

I'm quite happy that the UK has a form of democracy as defined by The Oxford Dictionary. "A system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives." In reality this is about as good as it gets.

 

QED?

 

Well my wife was Henry Ford, while I am King, what am I??? Something like that - sounding increasingly riddle-like.

 

I have just been out for the evening with some current and former colleagues and conversation included politics and one of the others said that she has never voted because she feels that no-one who has stood in a election she has been eligible to vote for deserves her support. She has the same opinion about politicians in general - so if she still lived in Australia, despite the compulsory vote, she still wouldn't because she would rather not use her vote than waste it on someone who doesn't deserve it. I do appreciate that there is the argument that by not voting, she's still wasting her vote.

 

We'll have to ask BB but I think that there is provision to abstain in Australian elections so that people like your former colleague are not subject to fines.

 

Just back up because I couldn't' sleep..

"I had a dream..."

 

We got the opposite - my wife was Martin Luther King...

 

I've never heard of such a provision. The law is quite clear-cut - it's compulsory for all eligible citizens to enrol and vote in all Federal, State elections, by-elections and referendums.

No-one can drag you to the polling booth though - but if you don't go voluntarily, without a valid excuse (sickness etc), there's a $20 fine. A lot choose to pay the fine as it's hardly a deterrent.

 

You have clearly married a wonderful human being. As have I.

 

My wife has reorganised the way we tackle household chores. Previously we would both load the dishwasher at the the same time, each have a hand on the Hoover as we vacuumed... Now she's started this thing she calls "Division of Labour" and we now have sole responsibility for the hoovering, sole responsibility for loading the dishwasher. Apparently it's making us more efficient.

 

.... erm... as I am

 

Ok. I wasn't sure about abstention. Maybe I just wanted to believe it!

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38101020

So that 'great' PM , Thatcher, wanted to dismantle the free NHS. Apologists to start apologising...

 

There are about 30 countries in the World where voting is compulsory. Closest to home are Belgium and Luxembourg. Belgium has had it since 1892 for men and 1949 for women. If they don't vote they get a small fine - if they don't vote in 4 elections then they can lose voting rights for up to 10 years. Also non voters can have problems getting jobs in the public sector. If you add to this that Belgium has the highest rate of naturalization of immigrants in Europe then elections there are extremely multi lingual with manifestoes and leaflets etc. being printed in up to 12 languages.

 

It's making YOU more efficient, as your wife can take a step backwards and direct your travail properly.

 

The NHS and provision for care of the elderly are emotive subjects when discussing finance. One thing is certain the UK cannot carry on with the present funding model. No politician is brave enough to suggest overdue necessary reforms which involve extra payments from patients in some form. The UK will soon have a debt of 2 trillion pounds. The substantial interest payment on this debt prevents funds being used for good causes.

 

The OED for once is inadequate here. Democracy is about more than simply government. It involves a guarantee of human rights; separation of executive, legislative and judicial powers; freedom of opinion and speech; religious liberty; equal voting rights; good governance. An elected government which denies free speech, for example, is not democratic.

 

So we collect the money for the NHS in a regressive or progressive manner. That's the only choice.
Thatcher didn't like it as a matter of principle.

 

It also involves active participation by the population, and not just once every 5 years. The present form of representative democracy means that you are a democracy for one day out of every 5 years, which is not enough. It also means complete access to all relevent information - a government which conceals facts from the public under the veil of 'classified information' is also not democratic.