Not in the slightest... that's a tired and predictable argument that is trotted out by all those who say that Wenger will be hard to replace... "you'll all the first to moan when you do worse with a new manager". Blah, blah, blah. Why would we moan? We put up with years of doing not a great deal with Wenger before we started to moan when we realised that really was it. We put up with years of even less than that before Wenger. I couldn't care less if we got worse. I don't follow Arsenal simply because they finish top 4 all the time. I support Arsenal because I always have and always will. I want to enjoy supporting Arsenal. I don't support one particular player or manager and if a player or manager is to the detriment of AFC then I want them out. Do teams that fall out of the top 4 lose all their fans? Do teams that fall out of the prem lose all their fans? I'm not sick of not winning the CL or league... what I'm sick of is having a muppet in charge who is paid the earth but doesn't care that he doesn't win the CL or league, makes no effort to address obvious team weaknesses and can't motivate his team for a whole season, is mentally weak but insists he's the complete opposite. I want someone in charge who tries... tries his damned hardest to make use of the resources available to him. All anyone can do is try their hardest. I've got no time for people coasting. And he's been doing that for years. He does only what he knows and never takes risks. He's timid, outdated, tactically suspect, overpaid and uninspiring.
I said it before, and I am biased of course, but I would much rather win the league, a few cups, the CL, then have a bad season or two and finish outside the top 4, ala Chelsea, than just top 4 every year....no title, CL last 16 every season, for the rest of eternity. I'd wager most of the people worried about falling out of the top 4 if Wenger leaves are young'uns who have only known Wenger their whole adult lives and fear some kind of apocalypse if he leaves (Sounds like Brexit ) The bad times make the good times all that much sweeter. But when all you have is "Meh" times, its hard to get passionate
See this is the crux of the argument. Wenger's current Arsenal incarnation is formulaic, uninspiring and lacking passion. In his early days he was passionate and cutting edge, his teams reflected that and they were a joy to watch and follow. Now it's become a corporate enterprise, a team built on sound financial principles and risk free profitable venture. Do we still play the best football in the league? I don't think that we do, t's a myth that we still do. Wenger has tried to maintain success on the pitch and in the financial Board rooms, but by doing so he has had to modify the way we play, at the detriment of our style of play. His frugality in the transfer market means that we never have a complete team, we are always missing 2-3 players. But those missing players have a major impact on the team, we are never able to truly challenge for the title or able to play in a style that Wenger wants. Take for example Giroud, he is a good player and he clearly has his uses, but is he a striker that is appropriate in a Wenger formation? Wenger is trying his best to resist splashing the cash in a stubborn effort to be right, but he is only hurting himself and the fans in the procedure.
There's no doubting your passion but be careful what you wish for. Personally for me the Chelsea side 2005/6 was the best team of the premiership history but I'd rather have the Chelsea from 1968 to 1973 any day.
Possibly, in the long run, it will prove to be the correct decision? I remember how cack Sanchez was last year after playing constantly for a year. Maybe he's trying to avoid that?
That's not what I said. I said it's a good job that those who run the club don't share your attitude of 'I couldn't care less if we got worse'
What's not what you said? I agreed those in charge of our club clearly don't share that attitude. Which you think is good. But I think that is precisely part of the problem. They're too scared of the possibility for negative outcomes that may come with change, as clearly are you. You're a success based fan. Happy to coast and achieve nothing but top 4 and the money that comes with it even though nothing is done with the money.
Personally I find it tiring that we have started yet another season poorly prepared, with blatant weaknesses still not addressed and to lose a winnable game again. Firstly I'll say that I think Liverpool played very well (besides Moreno) and set up very well and caused us lots of problems. On the basis of this game they look like they'll be a big threat this season. But the Euro2016 excuse is ridiculous - as far as I can see, Liverpool had more players in their starting 11 that played in the Euros than we did. Other teams played players who even played in the final while we didn't even play Santi, who didn't even play at the Euros or Xhaka who only played 4 games!!! To not be going all out to get a Defender when Merts was injured is scandalous, particularly as we needed an upgrade on him anyway. We should have been in a position to buy a CB before the season started and as soon as Gabriel got injured. I do say though that I much prefer finishing 2nd under Wenger than finishing 12th in the Prem under Graham/Rioch, even though watching Arsenal now is an exercise in frustration and 'almost there'. But we can't continue like this, having the same poor preparation to every season, having the same huge injury lists and recurring injuries to the same players, being a few players short of a great team every year. Losing badly and getting knocked out of the major competitions, then going on epic runs to salvage something out of the season, but always too late to actually win anything! It's nonsense!
Completely agree with this. It's as frustrating as hell seeing us come close but not close enough and then failing to adequately address our weaknesses. I want to see us push on but I don't want to see us throw the baby out with the bath water and replace wenger on just anybody simply to take a punt. Things could get a LOT worse.
Like I have said, sometimes you need to take a step back to take two steps forward. Who would you class as "just anybody"? I think Arsenal should go for Simeone to be honest. He is right up your boards alley, done wonders at Atletico on a much smaller budget than Real and Barca. He has been at Atletico for 5 years now and may look to join Pep, Jose and Conte in the PL if he is offered enough cash. I bet Wenger earns far more than he does. #PLallthebestmanagers Yeah just looked and he earns £4m a year at Atletico, think thats half of Wengers Arsenal salary.
We've jousted on this issue many a time before. But I still can't see how things would get significantly worse than they are now if we employed a different manager. The club aren't stupid enough to appoint someone like Iain Dowie, Gareth Southgate or Steve McClaren. So I really don't feel like there's much to be afraid of when AW leaves, providing the next manager is backed in the transfer market.
The thing is though, some of the names that have been suggested over the years though would very likely have taken us backwards. People like Owen coyle, Harry redknapp, fat sam, Martinez. I share the frustrations about Wenger, but I think it's dangerous to assume that another manager will simply be able to replicate what wenger does as a default position (ie finish in the top4 and qualify for CL football) based on our resources. There is a long drop beneath us and you cannot rule out that we could find ourselves in those positions. Also we've seen plenty of teams spend big and struggle. The formula isn't a simple as saying thatanybody could achieve what Wenger does. That said. Wenger is coming to the end of his time at Arsenal and he has struggled to replicate the success he had earlier in his career. If we could get somebody like simeone, I'd take him in a heartbeat.
So what? Even if you dropped out of the top 4 for a season, it would at least break the monotony of top 4, no league title, last 16 CL exit every year. Variety is the spice of life. And it would be totally worth it if the next manager was able to put together a team that could actually challenge for the top honours. Pointless being in the CL every year just to make up the numbers, if you are not going to make a concerted effort to win the damned thing.
Man U dropped out of the Top 4 after Fergie left and they've spent a ridiculous amount of money - seriously huge, more than anyone other than Man C or Chelsea could afford to spend, and they barely scrapped in to the top 4 once - and were a long way from challenging. If they hadn't been able to spend that money, and kept missing out Europe, Top 5/6 finish prize money in the league - do you think they'd be in the position they are now, where they are arguably favs?
Probably not. But the reason they struggled after Fergie left was because they were mismanaged and let down in the transfer market by Woodward. Fergie left a team in dire need of refreshing, RVP was past it, Scholes, Giggs and the old guard had retired, Vidic and Ferdinand were on their way out. And idiots Woodward signed only Juan Mata and Fellaini, a forward and a midfielder, when it was clear to see it was their defence that was the issue, and they needed a new striker. Arsenal do not need a overhaul, they have the makings of a decent, young squad. They have Ozil, Sanchez, Ramsey, Wilshere et all in their prime, they just need two big signings to cap it all off, a 1 in 2 striker and a leader at the back (CB). United needed a complete overhaul, totally different.
True, our squad is arguably in a better condition - though whether Gazidis is better than Woodward is another thing... But the point I was making is that it's not guaranteed that a dropping down the league positions would automatically mean you could shoot straight back up and perform as well as or better than we have been doing. The new manager could make Van Gaal style signings and buy in areas we don't need, or just sell our best players and ruin the team ect. In a worst case scenario. I thought Wenger should have left after our 1st FA Cup win, but he stayed on and we won the second, excellent. But he needs to go and be replaced - ideally by someone of the stature of Simone, who is then given the funds to buy some serious W/C talent. I just think it's ridiculous to assume that this is the worst Arsenal can ever get and a change can in no way make things worse. It seems an oddly blinded way of looking at the situation, almost only considering one side of the coin if you will.
