Sp!. Give a rest guys, you have different opinions and it seems they are not going to change so walk away and call it a tie.
Post #5465, that must've been about six months ago. My life isn't bad enough (yet) to sift back and workout who's said what and when. I'm not seeking recriminations, It's just a polite request.
Well you got the answer wrong last time. As Brexit supporters ignored all external opinion from some very balanced and worthy analysts - professional, political and economic which didn't fit the decision they had already made
Apologies, post 5645. This one... Utterly unprovoked. Col clearly doesn't want any posts that don't share his views. Well sorry, but no. I have as much right to post my views, and don't resort to personal remarks. I will continue to post my opinions here, whatever some may want to see this thread become.
I don't see anything personal in Col's response. It's robust, but no more so than many other responses have been posted on this thread and understandably so given the emotive nature of the topic.
It's being reported that the attack was carried out by a 17 year old Afghan boy who came as an unaccompanied refugee.
The knee-jerk reaction to so much of the bad stuff that is happening around us, such as Nice and now Wurzburg, seems to be to immediately call it a terrorist action. It's not helped by ISIS claiming responsibility, as if some turbaned mastermind sitting in a tent in the desert is plotting each of these. It is no surprise that ISIS would want to claim such atrocities as its own, but I don't believe that all of these things are being orchestrated in that way. Of course some perverted interpretation of Islam is a feature, but many of the perpetrators of these appalling acts seem to be disenfranchised cannabis-using misfits living on the margins of society. I am no lover of Islam - in fact, I believe allowing it to gain a significant foothold and grow in influence in the West, as it has done and will continue to do, will adversely impact on our way of life in many ways for years to come - but I cannot believe that real Muslims are pot-smoking, binge-drinking, violent social inadequates. Sure, it could be possible that cold, calculated individuals are encouraging the more impressionable, malleable and expendable patsies to carry out these awful things, but I don't believe this is the case in every instance. In my opinion, some of these are just introverted nutters suffering from years of substance abuse, albeit with a background of resentment towards Western values and a desire to bite the hand that now feeds. I fear that this sort of thing is nigh on impossible to prevent in every case. When the perpetrators of 7/7 have within their number a doctor and a teacher, it is understandable that a degree of paranoia should set in. When there is little by way of background checking undertaken on immigrants from trouble hotspots, it should be of little surprise that a number of unhinged, impressionable and ignorant undesirables should be set free among us. In a perverted way I find myself getting a little nostalgic for the IRA, ETA, Baader Meinhof and the Red Brigade, which in itself is wrong and pathetic.
In a perverted way I find myself getting a little nostalgic for the IRA, ETA, Baader Meinhof and the Red Brigade, which in itself is wrong and pathetic. something to be said for the attention seeking warning
I take your point but it's a known fact in the security services that terror cells latch onto and then radicalise the type of people that you describe.
Yes, I know and acknowledged that in my piece, Col. But I don't believe that is the case in many of the things we are now having to deal with. Unfortunately, I no more have the answers as the next man. The world has been changed irrevocably and many of us will pay the price. It is sickeningly ironic that those that have preached so much in the pursuit of world peace, such as the evangelical Mr Blair, have done the most to ensure that it will never happen. I have such a jaundiced view of mankind these days that I'm beginning to believe that the only way in which we can ensure a more peaceful existence is to keep separate different-minded people and cultures and let them deal with each other on an arm's length basis.
It is truly frightening how malleable and easily led many people are by what they see as 'authority figures', particularly those which promise them something better, even if through death. Not just these terrorists, most of whom are pathetic individuals - drugs, booze, petty crime - who clearly hate their own lives and reckon they have nothing to lose, but I was pondering the huge crowds that put themselves at risk because Erdogan asked them to (in defence of something which he blatantly obviously wants to destroy). We are now entering an era when you don't even need to plan much or have any skills to commit an atrocity, just the will to. Hesitate to post this but is this what you mean?
Sit down. I'm going to agree with you in places... It's a good thing that British firms can innovate and generate something from nothing to build an international business. The owners can do what they like with their company and sell it to whoever they want. That's their reward for generating a successful business. Some of that money might go towards starting new businesses - or even buying a British-made Sunseeker yacht, that's good for the UK too. The reason I brought them up in the first place was because you used them as an example of how it supported our Brexit decision. I'm still not fighting the Brexit argument when I point out that it just doesn't do that. The process of buying ARM would have started well before the referendum. At best, you can say that the referendum result didn't put them off (which is good - we need to be a successful country), but I'm sure they wouldn't have run away if the referendum had gone the other way, either. Can we leave it there, do you think?
At last a 'remainer' that can actually admit some of the benefits rather than the 'doom and Gloom' brigade. I agree with some of your points and doing some more research into the deal last night, i saw a few quotes saying that 'Arm was the backbone of our tech companies' and it was a shame that it will be owned by a foreign company. I guess i can agree with that however it is also good that a foreign company is taking a risk in the UK and will create more jobs. The Japanese CEO also said that Brexit made difference as he believes in the UK (however i think the price dropped a bit after Brexit so that probably helped). You brought up some good points and i hope my response also brought up points. Agree we will leave it there.
Reportedly shouted "Allahu Akbar" before the attacks and an ISIS flag has now been found in his accommodation. Another lone wolf attack, as called for by ISIS leaders.
ISIS will be claiming everything they can. They are getting hammered in Syria and Iraq now. Some of their fighters are abandoning their sick ideology. They claimed the Nice attacks but it is looking more likely that he was just a nutter. Now i am not saying this latest thing is not connected (i believe they found a drawing of an ISIS flag at his home). But now he is dead they can say what they want.
I suspect they're both ISIS related to a lesser or greater extent, but yes, there will be other issues in their lives. ISIS preys on these type of people to carry out suicide attacks (this Afghan youth tried to escape but must have known his chances of survival were slim) The concept of suicide bomber is anathema in the West. It was extremely rare in WW2 in Europe, and people viewed with horror the Japanese kamikazi pilots that were prepared to face certain death on the chance they might be able to plunge their explosive-laden aeroplane onto a US carrier. For Europeans, these suicide bombers were on the other side of the world. Now, with the influx of Muslims from certain parts of the world (it seems particularly North Africa, Afghanistan, and Pakistan) Europe has potential kamikazis among its population. Of course, the vast majority of these immigrants are benign, perfectly decent citizens, but it is this inherent aspect in their society (that can show in current refugees or the next generation from refugees as we saw in the 7/7 London bombings) that can lead to suicide attacks and mass murderer. They bring a Trojan horse. That's one of the reasons why, when the likes of the late Jo Cox called for increased immigration from Syria for the best of motives, it provoked such a sharp reaction, and sadly, I suspect, may have contributed to her murder by what seems to be a right wing extremist.
