Off Topic The trial of Ben Butler and Jennie Gray

First of all RIP to the beautiful little girl that was Ellie Gray who died in October 2013

Did anyone follow this case? It really really upset me, couldnt stop thinking about it for days. Ben shook her when she was 7 weeks old and she was took off her 'parents' and placed into the care of her maternal grandparents.

They raised her and she was thriving with them only for Butler to be released from prison where he hired the services of Max Clifford and went about clearing his name with appearances on daytime tv shows etc. Ellie was given back to her 'mum and dad' in Nov 2012. Less than a year later she was dead and her head injuries were likened to those caused in a high-speed car crash

Her grandparents tried to fight the decision and spent all of their life savings on fighting it. The grandfather even callled out "You will have blood on your hands" when the decision was granted in court and Ellie wanted to stay with her gran and grandad and was terrified at having to go and live with Butler and Gray

Mrs Justice Hogg's decision to give Ellie back to her 'parents' also went against the advice of the local council social workers and she instructed a private frim, Services For Children to handle it. They hurried it along and it all happened very quickly

Ellies grandmother died of cancer on the opening day of Butlers trial back in April. He should've been on trial a lot sooner but he changed his defence team 3 times to stall it all

To much about it all to type but lots all about it below

http://news.met.police.uk/news/father-of-ellie-butler-convicted-of-her-murder-169682

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...TY-murdering-six-year-old-daughter-Ellie.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/21/ellie-butler-murder-how-the-full-tragic-story-unfolded/

The thing that gets me the most is that she went from a brilliant, loving, fun eviroment to a complete living hell. Amongst other things she had a broken shoulder that hadnt been treated but she must've just been scared stiff about saying anything at school

What are the chances of someone getting hold of these scumbags inside?

 

Max clifford is scum.

 

Guy is total scum. People like him deserve the death penalty (presumably we won't find a miscarriage of justice later on). **** like this is why i cannot believe there is an all seeing all powerful god in this world

 

max clifford got his in the end though. I hope he gets everything coming.

and these two... deserve life and the worst conditions possible.

 

Shocking stuff.
The guy is clearly a psychopath, it's really up to the authorities to protect the vulnerable from people like him. They completely ****ed up on this one. Poor kid.

 

I'm surprised no member of the authorities is up on a charge also... or i should be surprised but i suppose i'm not.

 

to be fair (i only read the link of the one of the stories), all the authorities said do not give the child back to the parents but the stupid judge decided to give her back anyway.

 

so the judge should be charged with mansaughter

 

I agree.
Quite often stuff like this goes on behind closed doors and nobody knows until it's too late. This was a high-profile case and open to intense scrutiny. If they can get stuff like this so horribly wrong despite all the facts of the case you really have to wonder how we can have any faith at all in the process.
The reason I said the guy was a psychopath was because he was clearly quite plausible in his doting father role. He probably believed it himself at the time, and then something would snap and he'd change. The legal system has access to advisors who should easily have been able to see through this, given that the case was under investigation. A child's well-being, and ultimately her life, was at stake - and they let her down. It's not enough to put it down to misjudgement, it seems like clear incompetence.

 

Sickening, anybody who maliciously hurts anyone is ****ed in the head but people who do it to children are a particular kind of sick, seems like a lot of bureaucratic mistakes and bad decisions that assisted this person

 

It breaks my heart it really does

He likened his case to a Hillsborough documentary he had watched. He had a history of violent offences but Hogg said it wasnt on any children though She also said its is a pleasure to be involved in a case with such a happy ending when awarding Ellie back

The text messages were horrendous as well. He beat her up in March 2013 when she fell pregnant

• Jan 25 2013
  
  Butler to Gray: 05.11am "u bitch whore..six yrs at court..jail..hosp kids all ur f*** ups dint text ne giin (sic) to explode..u have until 10am"
  
  
• February 6 2013
  
  Butler to Gray: 2.58pm "Not being near me again...Fuming..U raise ur voice and thats prob..Now ul (sic) pay die v v v angry"
  
  
• March 16 2013
  
  Gray to Butler: 09.44am "I am bleeding and ignoring it and pain all for U, pretending U didn't make me kill a baby U didn't want. Pretending. I wont forgive U. I wish I was dead"
  
  Butler to Gray: 09.48am "u were told if we rowed again not to go hosp.. u do it and u risk kids..."
  
  Gray to Butler: 7.56pm "I am here because of fd abortion. U also brutally kicked me out too in wet and cold and etc..."
  
  
• March 19 2013
  
  Butler to Gray: 09.03am "cant do this its wrong to kids ok.. it s... im not looking after them after today im no gd.."
  
  Gray to Butler: 10.25pm "U want me to return there and be around U and leave hosp without getting DEAD BABY REMAINS OUT OF MY WOMB PROPERLY... so if I do not agree now U will grass FOR NO REASON to isw who will pass it to ss and U will have -- removed"
  
  
• March 21 2013
  
  Gray to Butler: 5.07pm "I will say U R liar. Then they will find her head and mark and it will come back to U, then --- adopted."
  
  Butler to Gray: 5.08pm "...she wont get adopted il take en on grounds of u... if u fight me say abt vio (sic) then they get adopted..its ova"
  
  
• March 21 2013
  
  Gray to Butler: 6.12pm "Today on 21/03/13 ben butler left me to die, he told me he wished I would die...ben told me he would beat me black and blue if I come home and to bring police.
  
  He told me he would take my children away from me because I am in hospital with suspected cancer, retained products and crohns disease..."
  
  Butler to Gray: 9.46om "ur mental and prob r to blame for ellie.. i dont care abt u u abs (sic) bitch.. last words geta sol.. now u get to live at hosp..dont bother me..or in fact try abt twelve tmos and ul c now go rot in urcbed.. war i mean it f*** off"
  
  
• July 18 2013
  
  Gray to Butler: 1.27pm “I am sorry I ruined your life. I am sorry all the things I have or haven’t done. I am sorry for all my part. I would do anything and die for U.”
  
  
• July 19 2013
  
  Butler to Gray: 10.22am “I cant cope anymre.. woke up I, in a rage already.. Been in place so many times.. my hands are shaking.. One more mistake im going to lose it ..ur pushing ny hate…we r nearly ova, i hate u.”
  
  
• August 22 2013
  
  Gray to Butler: 6.20am “Was nice sexy and good and then U nutted me like a bloke..”
  
  
• August 23 2013
  
  Gray to Butler: 8.56pm “I really do want U more than anything I ever wanted, even ny kids x..”

You can see from the text messages what a pair of vile scumbags they both are. Okay he may have controlled her and all that **** but she was Ellie's mother ffs, she should have done whats right and ignored everything else. It really pisses me off

 

you've got to let that stuff go cos it'll eat you up

 

It's an utterly horrific story, mate. It causes me to rage. Evil ****ing ****. I hope he does get what's coming.

 

Yeah its done my head in

The video (its on theDaily Mail link in the op, I wont post it) where she is staring at the ceiling in the kitchen while he walks in effing and blinding and shouting at her (you also notice a bandage on her shin as well). He's filming it on his phone and then there are two close ups of her face with her eyes shut still staring at the ceiling and what looks like a black eye. That vid was found on his phone in a draw at the house

Like I said mustve been a living hell for her and was doing my head in just thinking how could someone be such a ****. I dont know, sometimes something from the news can just get to you and this did

Anyway you're right I need to knock it on the head and stop thinking about it as nothing can change

 

I do, and her

 

Hard though it is to accept, that doesn't really matter. It won't bring back the poor girl and undo the suffering. Nature throws up psychos all the time, and threats of punishment don't deter them, because they're crazy.
Even if thoroughly deserved, whatever happens to him won't prevent similar things in the future. What bothers me more is the inability of our judiciary and social services to detect and prevent these things even when there's so much scrutiny given to the case.
Satisfying though it may be, a horrible end to this man won't prevent similar tragedies happening. We can't prevent madmen, we can only try and prevent them from harming others.

 

Well put as always and I do agree

I would just like them to be trapped in a prison where they are fearful and a target for pain from others

If no one can get to them I just hope that they are sorry and being locked up for so long (in Butlers case, she didnt get that long) that it tortures him every second

 

You have to kill the negative energy this generates in you and generate positive energy instead.

All the anger you feel just hurts you not that filthbag... sadly.

Therefore you just need to find a way to turn that around. Donate to a child service charity or something I dunno.

Do you get me?

 

Na...and I mean this without anger or as an act of revenge...child killers, mass murderers, serial killers, serial *****philes need a bullet...give them appeals etc but once all said and done and the process of justice runs it course they can not be trusted in society and can be nothing but a drain on resources.. bunching them all together in specialist prison units what does it serve? By giving them life in prison we are saying rehabilitation, the primary reason for incarceration other than protecting the public, is off the cards.

Shoot them, Bury them and use the resources saved on something more useful to society.

 

Oh I'd totally agree. No question here. Not pc or fashionable of course.