1. Log in now to remove adverts - no adverts at all to registered members!

Effect of Brexit

Discussion in 'Watford' started by Davylad, Mar 26, 2016.

  1. oldfrenchhorn

    oldfrenchhorn Well-Known Member
    Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    41,764
    Likes Received:
    14,236
    She is Home Secretary and could have gone a long way to clearing this area up. w_y says that ILR is a simple process, but what about the the staff who are working for the NHS who have not been in the country for five years? That does not apply to them.
     
    #941
  2. wear_yellow

    wear_yellow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    6,838
    Likes Received:
    642
    Welcome back Lenny - good to have an alternative opinion on this thread
     
    #942
  3. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2013
    Messages:
    11,075
    Likes Received:
    867
    The European Union Referendum Act 2015.

    On the bill's second reading MP's voted 544 to 53 in favour of the principle of holding a referendum with only the SNP opposing the bill.

    Massive endorsement for the referendum.
     
    #943
  4. wear_yellow

    wear_yellow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    6,838
    Likes Received:
    642
    What does personal sovereignty mean though? - can you give some examples of what you mean by this.
     
    #944
  5. wear_yellow

    wear_yellow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    6,838
    Likes Received:
    642
    I would imagine that they would transfer to the Tier 2 Visa scheme that non-EU citizens live and work in the UK on. This would be one of the many items to be worked out. The scheme exists, so we would just need a process for those in this situation to apply for a Tier 2 Visa - even for the civil service it should not be too difficult to devise.
     
    #945
  6. oldfrenchhorn

    oldfrenchhorn Well-Known Member
    Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    41,764
    Likes Received:
    14,236
    Looks as if this is only the start of many.

    Legal steps have been taken to ensure the UK Government will not trigger the procedure for withdrawal from the EU without an Act of Parliament. The case is being brought by leading law firm, Mishcon de Reya, on behalf of a group of clients. Following publication of articles on the subject this week Mishcon de Reya has retained Baron David Pannick QC and Tom Hickman to act as counsel in this action, along with Rhodri Thompson QC and Anneli Howard.
    We must ensure that the Government follows the correct process to have legal certainty and protect the UK Constitution and the sovereignty of Parliament in these unprecedented circumstances. The result of the Referendum is not in doubt, but we need a process that follows UK law to enact it. The outcome of the Referendum itself is not legally binding and for the current or future Prime Minister to invoke Article 50 without the approval of Parliament is unlawful.
     
    #946
  7. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2011
    Messages:
    14,952
    Likes Received:
    4,851
    Personal sovereignty means having control over your own affairs and legal status.
     
    #947
  8. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2013
    Messages:
    11,075
    Likes Received:
    867
    Other legal buffs have argued that the approval of parliament is not required, they state the PM has authority under section2(2) of the European Communities Act 1972.

    I'm sure the government will have sound advice.
     
    #948
  9. oldfrenchhorn

    oldfrenchhorn Well-Known Member
    Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    41,764
    Likes Received:
    14,236
    Whatever, the delays will continue. Meanwhile the country will be left in limbo.
     
    #949
  10. Hornet-Fez

    Hornet-Fez Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2011
    Messages:
    9,718
    Likes Received:
    5,082
     
    #950
    andytoprankin likes this.

  11. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2011
    Messages:
    14,952
    Likes Received:
    4,851
    That may be so in the tinpot dictatorship of your dreams SH. Parliament is sovereign in this issue and some newly thrown up emergency PM. does not have the mandate either for this or to govern the UK. until 2020.
     
    #951
  12. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2013
    Messages:
    11,075
    Likes Received:
    867
    AfD in Germany are calling for a referendum saying the German people want to be free of EU slavery.

    Cologne, how many seats will they win next year?

    I understand referendums are not allowed in Germany at the moment.
     
    #952
  13. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2013
    Messages:
    11,075
    Likes Received:
    867
    You are wrong on both of these subjects.

    The PM does have authority to invoke article 50 as outlined in previous post.
    The Tories have a mandate to govern until 2020. The referendum choice was in the manifesto.
     
    #953
  14. wear_yellow

    wear_yellow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    6,838
    Likes Received:
    642
    You have control over your affairs and legal status - you have chosen to live in another country for many years without becoming a citizen of that country. After a Brexit you will continue to have a choice, you can adopt the country of your choice under whatever scheme they have in place for non-EU citizens or return to the country of your nationality. Seems to me that you would rather have your cake and eat it!
     
    #954
  15. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2011
    Messages:
    14,952
    Likes Received:
    4,851
    The AfD have never suggested withdrawing from the EU. their opposition is primarily against EMU. It does not matter how many seats they win nobody will go into coalition with them. Expect a ruling coalition of SPD. the Greens and Die Linke next year.
     
    #955
  16. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2013
    Messages:
    11,075
    Likes Received:
    867
    A party spokesman branded Brussels a "bureaucracy monster" and added "Next year the AfD will enter the German parliament and Dexit will be top of our agenda"

    sounds as if they are quite keen.
     
    #956
  17. Hornet-Fez

    Hornet-Fez Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2011
    Messages:
    9,718
    Likes Received:
    5,082
    Similar principles as to how Hitler came to and retained power: voted for by a minority; took control from an incompetent president; invoked the disunity to create a dictatorship; bullied the majority of the electorate into something that they didn't actually vote for.
     
    #957
    andytoprankin likes this.
  18. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2011
    Messages:
    14,952
    Likes Received:
    4,851
    How do you know anything about my citizenship status W_Y ? I have dual nationality. I am not getting up in arms about my case - but for all the others who are here. Make no mistake about it, I would rather have no nationality at all - but the world compels me to have some kind of passport, so why not 2 while I'm about it. All this thing about sovereignty is a myth. Sovereignty can be personal, it can be to do with an area or town, regional, based on a nation state, or a type of pooled sovereignty as in the EU. (the latter of these has the most leverage). True sovereignty is when a man lives in a forest and gathers his food from the wild. You, on the other hand, need someone else to feed you, someone else to clothe you, someone else to protect your property, someone else to build your car etc. No man is an island, and it is the same with countries in our globalized world - and in no case is this more true than in the UK. which imports a higher percentage of its food than any other country. True sovereignty comes from self sufficiency - the anarchist dream of Thoreau.
     
    #958
    andytoprankin likes this.
  19. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2011
    Messages:
    14,952
    Likes Received:
    4,851
    Some of Brexit's posters actually reminded me of the type of propaganda which circulated in Germany in the 1930's, Goebbels would have been proud of them.
     
    #959
    Hornet-Fez and andytoprankin like this.
  20. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2011
    Messages:
    14,952
    Likes Received:
    4,851
    You do talk crap at times !
     
    #960

Share This Page