Turkey will join the EU one day. Soon? Maybe not, but it will happen. When you have our own Prime Minister actively encouraging their entry you know things are bad. Before anyone says that he hasn't, oh yes he has. He has conveniently back tracked over the last couple of months because he doesn't want his views to affect the referendum. Turkey, in no way shape or form should ever be admitted to the EU. Allow free movement and that will be it. It will happen though. Whatever people's views on whether to leave, I think most would agree that allowing the Turks into the EU is a very bad move. Likewise Russia one day.
I'd be interested to know why you think Turkey are on the cusp of joining? Two actual facts I know are: a) Of the 35 different policy areas Turkey has to adopt to be eligible to join they have so far adopted one - in 12 years! In most areas they haven't even started trying, every other 'new' member has had to jump through these hoops and it would be a huge departure to just allow Turkey to do so. b) Even if Turkey magically managed to adopt all the 35 qualifying policies (some of which are not things which can be suddenly done but take literally years) EVERY single existing EU state has to sign the treaty to allow them to join. This obviously includes us if we are a member of the EU. The idea that we have no control over "floods of immigrants" is a fallacy pushed by Brexit. The numbers are so vastly different to what the Daily Express print it's propaganda of the highest order.
I would very much agree that having Turkey and Russia - or indeed any country who do not abide by the previous rules and safeguards - come into the EU would be a negative. There has to be policing of members.
I'd be against Iran joining the EU, what with their stoning of adulterers and their imprisonment of journalists and political opponents, likewise North Korea with their enslaving a good proportion of their citizens in work camps. But it's not going to happen unless something huge changes in the future, so I'm not letting it affect my decision whether or not to stay in. Same with Turkey and their increasing paranoia about people insulting their president, as well as their ongoing war against the Kurds. Joining the EU is just not going to happen for them unless a lot of things change massively. So put the issue to one side and make your decision based on stuff that actually matters.
Sure, but Russia joining the EU? I'm sure it has mooted by some fantasists out there in the past but, seriously, Russia joining the EU? Back to reality people.
Back to statistical analysis when looking at net migration http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36517971 For me any of those sets of figures are too high as the resources of this country are finite. I accept that simply leaving the EU is not the entire answer but it is, for me, part of the answer. We still then have to implement a more structured immigration policy where we allow in those who can contribute to the benefit of the country. Also I also accept that we as a country have a moral obligation to help others such as asylum seekers and refugees but preface both words with the word "genuine". This to me though just makes it even more important to properly control the people and the numbers coming into this country. Something which does not seem possible within the EU.
Interesting take on the environmental benefits being a member of the EU has bought if it's of interest. I do sort of think this kind of information gets lost in all the headline making nonsense. http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/13/eu-referendum-environment-filthy-beaches
The immigration figures - the number of refugees stated in the figures you quote there are 5,000 penfold and yet the papers make it sound like 275,000 rapist and murders are going to come marauding over the horizon. Also the majority of the immigrants are non-EU. As for benefits to being in the EU, I live in Liverpool and the amount of money put into the docklands and urban regeneration in the last year from the EU dwarfs that from government in this country. The same is true of Sheffield and i suspect (though am not as au fait) many other northern cities. Tie this with the protection for employees, the Union leaders and Labour party (well every serious party) backing Remain, experts almost universally agreeing it will be a negative on the economy and will increase the cost of general produce and i find it astounding that ANY northerners would vote Brexit. The EU laws are pretty much entirely about protection consumers, workers, individuals against the state, big companies and corrupt individuals looking to line their own pockets. I take my hat off to Brexit as they have had a look at the main policies and clearly realised they do not help them so instead have focused on one or two emotive side issues and tried to make everyone just focus on those. It has worked, it reminds me a lot of: http://www.southparkstudios.co.uk/clips/103454/the-chewbacca-defense
This is something that is of benefit to us all and the main reason why I would vote Remain. Without the EU I wouldn't trust the UK Government to look after their own people but to spy on them and to restrict their rights. Sadly what the governments of the day are doing are not against the Constitution, and they know it, so the Queen can't step in and stop the process. If I could trust my government to be for the people and not be for themselves: a tenet which has been going on for too many parliaments, then I would be voting out. It's a sad day when I have to look to the EU for the protection of our rights but there's no-one else.
Watching a documentary on BBC2 now and something that someone mentioned was that the UK needs immigration of young people to help pay for the ageing population. Interesting take on it. EU immigrants are net contributors to the state.
Turkey joining the EU may be some years away,however, talk of giving 1,500,000 priviledged passports to Turkish citizens, so a lot could be coming sooner rather than later.
There are like 33 chapters of the EU charter, and Turkey have applied for membership in the past and reached only 1 or 2 in decades. Jesus Christ stop spreading this bull to convince idiots to vote out
I accept we have a morale obligation, but it shouldnt all be down to us, other countries have to muck in and whilst I conceed that some do, some middle eastern power houses ignore this and keep their own self interest at heart. One thing I find absolutely astonishing is that we give £10billion a year on foreign aid, whist having a massive deficit and 1.5trillion pounds worth of debt. This is similar to me getting to the week before payday, being skint and then thinking, hmm, i'll take out a Wonga Loan but instead of buying food or paying debt, I'll donate all of the £200.00 loan to oxfam. the only difference with this analogy is that Oxfam actually get my money, with foreign aid its given to nigerian princes, somalian politicians and alike. The amount of money, litterally trillions and trillions given to these counties since band aid by western governments and it makes little to no difference because the politicians in charge fail to let the money trickle down. I know what a Veto is, good luck getting Camoron and his goons to exercise it. He wants a job in the EU and will his best to serve them on his knees. Another politican with his own self interests at heart, he doesnt want to remain for the good of this country, he wants to further his career in the european powerhouse superstate!
Well listen, in the event we leave, we'll have no veto and we'll probably have to accept free movement as part of any trade deal we end up signing. Not much better. And even if we don't accept free movement, Scotland is likely to leave the UK for the EU and create a 100 mile land border with the Schengen area, making illegal immigration much harder to control than it currently is.
Using the numbers you quote regarding our debt and the amount for foreign aid (not saying they're correct but for arguments sake I'll just use them) it's the equivalent of getting to the week before payday and chucking a quid at a tramp. As a percentage of our debt it is negligible. The issue with using numbers in your argument is: a) it gives a false impression of a fact, this is what statistics are generally used for in news media but without context they mean nothing. Good example is that the Daily express have stated as headlines in the last year that each migrant costs us £1m and that there are going to be 2 million immigrants flooding our shores. So the message they are spreading is that we are going to need to pay out £2,000,000,000,000 to cover the costs of immigration, that's £30k each - which is clearly bollocks. They use bogus numbers because people see numbers and think "you can't just make that up", yes you can. You really can. b) Without holistic reasoning they are pointless. It's like when your insurance renewal quote comes in and they tell you on the letter they are giving you a good deal but don't mention anywhere what you paid last year. Do you 1) say "wow they tell me it's a good deal so it must be" or 2) go check what you paid last year, go online and get other quotes, etc. People are smart enough to use these thought processes they are just too lazy to bother with most things.
