Surely democracy gives people the right to vote or not vote as they think fit. Many people cannot be bothered unless there is a sudden hike in their taxes. It becomes more and more difficult to fill all of the seats on a local council because people do not have the time and just use the place where they live as somewhere to put their heads down for the night. The drive that fires people like cologne is sadly lacking in the majority, but you cannot change attitudes if they are not interested to the point where they do not even listen.
I like to think that im middle of the road so ant far left or right should be shot or is that to extreme LOL
Frenchie, as you will have gathered, I am interested in local initiatives which do not wait for central government. In particular I have looked at the transition town network - where a town actually takes over the responsibility for reducing its own carbon balance - so, we know that my town of Engelskirchen produces 11.6 tons of Co2 per head per year and the developmental plan is to reduce that without waiting for initiatives from above. This involves transportation ie. reducing energy usage and reducing the reliance on long supply chains which are dependent on fossil fuels. In this context it is laughable that a rural town is dependent on a couple of supermarkets. The second point is food production, which involves community gardens and having more people engaged in food production. The third point is waste & recycling - firstly the aim of a 'zero waste' community, and secondly trying to match the waste of one industry with the needs of another. Fourthly is a recognition that the biggest asset which any town has is its own citizens and to try to make sure that all local talents are being used without automatically looking for external help with projects. Also energy descent action plans come into play here - ie. local communities producing as much of their electricity as possible (much of ours here is hydro electric). The last point is economic - if I am giving out money to a local shop it is more likely to be circulated in my area than if given out to a supermarket chain. Some places already have 'local' currencies which are accepted by many local businesses - there is a 'Totnes' pound, just as there is in Lewes, Stroud, Brixton, Bristol, Exeter and Cardiff. These are examples of where communities have decided to try to shape their own futures. It can be done. I would add to these elements that I would rather that the local firm were a workers cooperative, or at least a small family firm, because then, their decisions are more likely to respect my environment.
Cologne, you will have noticed that my post was about local government which is as close to people as possible. We tried many local initiatives and some people liked the ideas we put forward, but as I indicated the majority are too busy with their own lives and really were frightened that if they showed too much interest they would be asked to do something for the community. Although people like you and I are prepared to give of our time and whatever talents we might have, we should not believe that others think in the same way. When we pushed ahead with some schemes it was without the majority of the population agreeing, but they didn't disagree either. They just accepted what was happening and providing it didn't cost them let it progress.
Frenchie, the initiatives which I have referred to did not always come from local councils, although their cooperation is necessary. It is necessary to activate other institutions (churches and mosques included). When we actually employed a body of so called professionals to calculate the Co2 balance of the town and to do studies on mobility, agriculture etc. in the area we found it to be not only a waste of money but also betrayed the principal of keeping these things local - my impression was that the upper forms of the local grammar school could have produced a study every bit as good. Which they eventually did (this being possible because it was not the initiative of one party but rather of the whole council). Once kids of 17-18 are involved then activating their parents becomes easier.
We engaged with just about every organization in our village, but still found that most people were not interested. Can you tell me if things are different there? What percentage of the people there are involved? We were thought to be very progressive compared to some, with some success, but we never managed to get more than a third of the population involved.
I think that things may be slightly different here, but that is not a general difference between Germany and France, The area where we live is about 40km. east of Cologne in what was once a mining and textile area - forestry was, and still is, very important. Germany suffers very much from rural depopulation - about 20 years ago the council here were reckoning with a population of about 25,000 - in fact it has dropped below 20,000. House prices are falling here and this is normally a trigger for action. In other words there was general consensus that something had to change and that we needed some kind of developmental concept as to how Engelskirchen would look in say 10 years time. This is even more of a problem in the East of Germany. Another difference is that very few new families have moved to the area (bad internet connections may also have something to do with this, together with a bad public transport system) - which means that most of the people living here have been here for quite some considerable time. The last point may be crucial because I think that increased mobility may have led to a lack of involvement in local politics, particularly in Britain, - if the majority of people living in a place were not brought up there, and have no intention of growing old there, then they are unlikely to engage in local politics. The German population is, generally, less mobile than the British - not sure about France.
My comments above did relate to the UK cologne where many people were commuting to London, Milton Keynes, Oxford or Birmingham. Having spent twenty odd years offering my services I had had enough so moved over here. There is a big difference between your numbers and mine. We had a electoral role of 380 and to get 120 involved seemed quite good, but it still meant that is was always the same people who were involved in trying to get things moving. In my part of France I have seen that people will still go to public meetings, but we also have an ageing population, and if it wasn't for the ex-pats who have bought property the villages would have died. One nearby village has a population of 100% Dutch. No public transport at all in the rural areas, so the car is essential as distances are too large to walk or cycle to. My neighbour lived in Paris at one time, but since he left there 20 years ago has never been more than 40 miles from home. There is real discontent in the whole region with central government because of the mismanagement of the economy which promised so much, but has dug a very large hole that they cannot climb out of. Money grew on trees four years ago, but there has been a bad harvest, so today there is none available even for basic things.
all. This is a much more interesting thread than the muck-throwing Politics one. Really enjoying ofh and cologne discourse.
Unmade beds, used tampons etc. is not Modern Art and Tracey Emin is not an "artist" or is Modern Art actually art?
My unmade bed is definitely not modern art, though on good days I think there's something of the Renaissance about it
How about, does Obama have the right to express opinions about British politics ? I am in favour of remaining in the EU. (for now) but do not think that a US. President has this right - European politicians have not expressed their opinions so openly on this and Merkel has said that it is a 'British' matter. My feeling is that Obama may actually influence some on the left, particularly opponents of TTIP, to vote for Brexit here.
Another possibility is the following. The present Pope Francis returned from his visit to Lesbos with 12 refugees who will be living in the Vatican. He has called on all Catholics to perform similar actions - in Germany there are currently 420 refugees claiming church asylum (both in Catholic and in Protestant churches) and the German state will not violate this. In fact, the interior of the Cologne Cathedral is not sovereign German territory and so, in principle, any refugee could move in there and the only authority deciding this case is the Archbishop of Cologne. Is church asylum still relevant today ? and does the church have the right to engage itself in politics ?
I think President Obama is in a difficult seat. He has to show what the US is thinking (perhaps not his view) and what he says will upset someone, if he says remain the leavers will be unhappy or the other way around. Also if he says nothing he will be criticised for being silent. He is aying what is best for US not Britain and as he is the president of US then he can say what is best for his nation. Perhaps he could have said his opinion in private as this subject is delicate. The British think they have a special relation with US but this is not the case, US only does what it needs to get what it wants. For example how many British citizens go to the US for court when the US want them and how many go the other way?
Well some interesting bits here that I might comment on. A couple of years ago I was down south in Provence. Wandering along a street in a small town I came across what looked like a garage on the side of a house, with the double doors open and a sign inviting you to come in and view the art on display. As someone who cannot paint or draw without the aid of a tee and set square, I marvel at those who can. Inside were paintings that were two hundred years old, mainly portraits, that were amazing in the texture of the subjects skin and clothing. You could imagine what it would be like to the touch. Alongside were some modern paintings consisting of nothing more than coloured dots. There was a description of what I should be able to see, but despite looking at them for a long time I just couldn't see what the artist intended. The President came out with some things which if you had chance to listen made sense, and followed what numerous others that side of the pond had been saying. Nothing new, just a greater exposure because of who he is. Similar things can be read everyday in the French press when government ministers have been speaking, but so far none of them have achieved quite the same status. Marine Le Pen has said she will be going to the UK to lend her support to the exit campaign, but leaders of the exit group want her banned from entering the country. I don't see that she should be stopped or it might show bias. The French state owns the Christian churches here so I doubt that you could seek sanctuary in one. Synagogues and Mosques I doubt can be owned by the country, so it could be different in those. I am not sure if it is different though to someone living in an embassy for years rather than face arrest.
