For it to work, the PC brigade need gagging. Troublesome youngsters won't suddenly start towing the line because they're outcasts. The leaders need to treat them as troublesome youngsters, not be their best mate for ease of their own working life!
I thought you should be made aware gerrez was suggesting people with dodgy backs are putting it on... I believed you
Well there is a fine balance. On one hand we don't want Softly Softly, hands off approach. But we don't want to get all Guantanamo on their asses either. Make it clear that this is to help them, and help them understand why it must be done and come to their own conclusions.
Actually wasn't thinking of it as a punishment but a choice put to them. Say a % of council tax put aside for kids to opt into "national service" They spend a year or two part time doing local community work..fixing up where they live, looking after the local elderly etc etc and as a reward they get the foot up in what they want to do. If it's about teaching them self respect and respect for those around them they need to see that if they help their community their community helps them. They also get to know their neighbours through the work so they aren't just things to abuse but real people. Rather than getting them to do stuff that is alien to their own environment. It also shows the community not to be distrustful of the kids on the street outside..they are not all a hoody threat if they are painting your fence or doing your garden. In my day it was called "Bob a job" lol....and all I got was a badge and about 50p for a days work lol. But.....if you don't choose to take the opportunity and behave in an anti social way..make the punishments harsh...not a piece of paper and warnings...time inside with no gyms or TVs or mod cons...square rooms and 3 plain meals... Just don't see why a community if offering this type of cooperation has to sit and be understanding of those that choose not to take it. Of course it'll probably be against their Europeans human rights or something......
Nope, I don't agree. Make it something they won't enjoy at all and therefore they won't want to do it or return to it. Ie, make it a deterrent!
Good idea but I think you'd attract the wrong youngsters. You'd get the ones that are behaved and want to learn, they're usually the ones that also want to put something back into the community too (from my experience of course)
I agree. But there is no reason why they cant be made to both a) Hate the experience and b) be made to understand that its for their own good. Communication is key. Punishment needs to be met out to these people, they need to learn that there are consequences when they don't tow the line in terms of social responsibility. Don't get me wrong, if they flat out refuse to understand the situation, they should be forced to do it anyway, and punished with incarceration if they refuse, but I just don't think the sack over the head, piled into the back of a truck and taken to Auschwitz type punishment works well either.
Usually, if you do something for the good of the community, it gives you a feel good factor as a result because you've helped. Can't see too many not enjoying that side of it. of course, if it takes two months worth of work to reach that point then its slightly different.
True...but then if you are targeting under privileged areas you are still rewarding those good kids and helping them out...you may even convince some of the others ...few less in prison ten years down the line got to be worth it. And isn't there some evidence somewhere that if you get a community to look after and spruce up its surroundings crime and anti social behaviour drops? Will have to go look that up.
I guess I'm coming at this from a different angle. I see the more behaved kids get involved in things anyway, that already happens. It also goes towards the educational records too. I also see the misbehaved ones and the trouble they cause. I rarely see the "normal ones"
Looking quickly the average drop in crime appears to be between 3 and 10% where community cohesiveness programmes have been adopted.
I never said the existing programmes don't work at all, it does work for some. But it is blatantly obvious that a lot in attendance just don't care. They don't even get into trouble if they simply don't attend either Why? Because they are almost untouchable!
I think a great way to save money is to reduce all those luxuries in prison. Why are these guys enjoying cushty prison life when they are in there for a reason.
Which I suppose is why you need the "reward" Two teenage girls from absentee families given the choice of doing community work and getting money towards education or a flat or get pregnant and be put in shared accommodation rather than a flat of their own. You may still get ones thinking the pregnancy is the easier choice..but once up and running if the evidence is there to point to rather than as an abstract told to them. Stop making it a grand plan..that is alien or seems unattainable to the kids in the area..make it tangible..
I can't see you getting too many disagreeing with that! It is ****ing ridiculous that someone that's committed a crime, whether it be petty or not, gets the PC brigade protecting their "right" to a acceptable way of life. **** that! If you don't want to live a boring dull environment with other arseholes, don't commit the bloody crime FFS!
But then that's where I am quite up for harsh no feeling sorry for the ones that don't. If you have this kind of thing in place then there is no excuse.. Chuck the others in new borstals with **** all in them but the option to sit in empty cell or go to the classroom....**** em.
