Off Topic Political Debate

I suppose Britain could use the same approach France did over British Beef imports?

 

So if you have moved to France, you are saying you need a Visa / Green Card to visit France? You are not clear just what you will need these documents for!

On the first paragraph - firstly by not having to fund the EU gravy train, Britain would be Billions of £'s better off every year. Our elected government can choose how to spend that money. If the NHS needs workers then they can obtain them from European countries or non European countries on the same basis - wherever the skills available. Personally I would prefer to seek skilled workers in developed countries and not poach vital well trained medical staff from poor countries. It's called controlled working immigration and works just fine today - I have 5 Indians working for me at the moment on a work visa.

Generally Laws as a whole do not impact countries, they impact individuals and business and it's not just laws, it's the mass of directives and their inconsistent implementation that has caused issues. For instance SEPA and WEEE have been nightmares for European companies as a whole. In addition WEEE has resulted in the mass dumping of electrical goods in 3rd world countries - very neighbourly. The EU is slow to react and slow to act, it's a 19th Century model of government. Everyone jokes about straight bananas, but many of these stories have a basis in truth.

I think the whole benefits debate to be a side show. I do not agree that people working in this country should be treated any differently - if they are approved to work in this country, they should be treated equally. I do not agree that any child benefit should be paid to children not residing in Britain, but any child legally in Britain should receive the same child benefit irrespective of nationality. I also believe that should be the same in all countries, so a Brit living in Denmark should not be able to receive child benefit for a child in Germany or Britain. Personally I think in work benefits are completely wrong and employers should be forced to pay decent wages - uncontrolled immigration, particularly from the poorer EU countries has fuelled this and led to a dumbing down of our country.

If the vote is to get out and the economy tanks, you can hardly blame the Tory government as they are against leaving. You can blame the voters and you can blame the government of whatever shade if they do not fix the issues are a few years as that is what they are paid to do - if it was a business they would be sacked.

 

Just to add a laugh (well for us Right Wingers)

Just heard on the radio. Cameron giving his details to Parliament on what happened at Brussels in his negotiations with the EU countries.
Comrade Corbyn then stands up to give his response and says he too has been in Brussels and he too has spoken to Heads of States.
'Do you know what they said to me'?
At which point some Tory wag shouts out.
'Who are you'.

Uproar and frivolity ensues

 

I moved back here to help my parents out in their old age, hoping to get a job near my house, IT hasn't really caught up in rural France so moving back to London next week. I'd have needed a visa/green card to do so if Brexit happens.

The UK pays in more than other countries because it's richer (like Germany and France), but they also receive more cash than other countries back (farmer subsidies, development grants, etc). We're going to have to fund that ourselves, and it runs in the hundreds of millions of £s per year. The harder we make it to move here, the less likely people will want to move here permanently, whatever their job. If the economy tanks then the £ will be worthless to EU migrants anyway, so we'll definitely be raiding 3rd world country for their doctors and dentists. If it affects the cost of living (imports are more expensive), then yet again it'll be the poorest that suffer the most. Not a gamble worth taking in my opinion...

If EU laws don't affect countries, what's up with the whole Sovereignty issue then? I've never encountered SEPA or WEEE before, but a brief bit of research gave me an idea. WEEE seems like a great idea, it's mankind's greed that results in it being shipped to poorer countries for processing. SEPA relates to money transfers in the EU, am I right? Doesn't seem like a valid reason to quit the EU.

You may not see the benefits debate as being relevant, but it's what's fuelled the anti-EU feeling in the UK for the last decade at least. It's not EU migration that's caused the Tax credit issue, it's the greed from employers, and you can hardly blame the EU for that. Luckily those poor employers were given massive tax cuts by the Tories too, just in case they couldn't afford their new yacht this year.

The Tories are not against leaving, Cameron and Osborne may claim they are but it'd only be for their 'legacy'. BoJo joined the bandwagon too...Can't remember the exact % but it's a fair few.

To summarise, if we leave the EU will be down to people (not everyone of course, but a large % of the Brexit voters) with little grasp of the risks it involves, making a decision based on decades of the Sun/Mail/Express lies and exaggerations. The average Sun reader will come up with the same cliched arguments, most of which have appeared on here, about gravytrains, Human Rights and straight bananas, but could probably not even name even half the countries in the EU or place them on a map (unless they've had a Euro tournament there recently).

Let's hope their irrational hatred isn't enough to make them vote on the 23rd, they generally don't...

 

How professional...

And these people should be in full control of the UK? Bring on 2020...

 

I also thought it would not take long for the insults and mass generalisations about people with opposing views to start - and again I would be bet on the culprit - head shaking in Bandit Country

 

That works both ways, Comrade Corbyn

 

That is a term that he uses frequently and is used frequently by his supporters like William Bragg....check out a few of his meetings on Youtube. It's a term of endearment..

 

Most of the links are to videos hosted by the Mail and Telegraph, how ironic

He may use the term 'comrade' as a joke, but I doubt he does it during PMQs or Parliament.

Also, since when do politicians allow their Wives and Girlfriends (WAGs) into Parliament? Or was it just a misogynistic dig at a female Tory MP?

 

Deuce

 

I was down my fields this afternoon, and as usual was joined by my little friend called Robin. In a series of tweets we discussed the news of the day which is quite normal. Being a French Robin he knew that what some of us had to say was not trying to scare people, just inform them of how things are different over here. "Do they know what life outside the EU would be like, or are they speculating on what it might be like? They are speculating I think, but they do not have anything positive to hold on to, whereas those of us who know how the present system works can see that although that not everything is as it could/should be, believe that things are moving forward slowly. " Do you have a tin opener on that knife of yours as I can see a large can of worms I would like to get into,"

 

I wish you were leading the campaign rather than Mr Cameron!

 

Did the robin tell you that the technocrats are moving slowly, without any democratic consensus, towards political and fiscal union?

Maybe better to speak to a wise owl.

 

Just maybe be better to stick with the robin than take advice from someone who admits to making bad decisions and losing shed loads of money.

 

It appears the 'ins' have very thin skins and a real sense of humour failure.

 

I suspect that just like the worms there is some wiggling going on here.

 

If that was an attempt at humour then I'm much happier with the efforts of the yes camp.

 

Do you talk to birds or are flowers your thing, like Charles?

 

I think you are slipping. Have a chat to George and Nigel and they will give you some lines to raise a few hackles.

 

My teddy bear actually.