Off Topic Political Debate

Just heard a German radio station talking about the so called refugee crisis, and then in the next sentence talking about how the German weapons export industry is on an all time high - apparently not making a connection between the two ! If the Americans, Russians, Chinese, Germans, British etc. were not exporting most of the Worlds' weapons would we have a refugee crisis ? I don't think so.

 

A recent government report warned of potential chaos for schools, housing and health due to immigrants from Eastern European countries.

 

No answer to my question?

Guide me to your report please.

 

I am not aware of your government report but there is plenty of evidence in the affected communities which suffer uncontrolled immigration. There is no opportunity to develop amenities in a sustainable way.
Many towns have their whole character changed dramatically with immigrant communities living a life without full integration.
It is quite a simple request for the UK to control its own borders which at present it cannot do.

 

As I said the report commissioned by Cameron was not published because sources said it contained no useful information, although it was fully reported in the Financial Times, which is why I would like to see the report that you quoted. Please point me towards it as I would like to see it.

 

SH. There are 3 towns in England where white British have become a minority - Leicester, Luton and Slough. Taking Luton as an example it is 35% White British, 18% Pakistani origin, 16% Indian origin, 5% other Asian, 5% African, 2% Caribbean and 10% other white (which includes Irish, Italian etc.) In what way does this picture have anything to do with the EU. and how do you suppose it would change by leaving it ? Also, how do you define integration ? Because 81% of the population of Luton have British passports.

 

The report I referred to was mistakenly on my part an earlier report from the last Labour government. Unfortunately they underestimated the eventual negative events.

The reason immigration has been the number one concern of voters is due to the ever increasing effect of uncontrolled immigration. The Labour Party tried to play down the importance so subsequently lost many votes to UKIP in Northern towns.
The Schengen Agreement experiment has obviously failed spectacularly. It assisted in the terrorist attacks in Paris.

In my view every country in Europe should have control of its own borders not just the UK.

 

I am disappointed SH as you said your report was recent.

 

Not as disappointed as me.

It was an online Daily Mail report that was dated 16th Feb 2016 saying 'recent' so quite easy to make a mistake.

 

I've been here nearly 20 years - I think that means I definitely don't.

 

That will teach you to read that rag.

 

I read many online newspapers including the DM. I only buy the Telegraph on Saturday and the Sunday Times. I'm not sure if the article was in their online publication on that date but it just popped up in search. Incidentally there are many decent articles in the DM which everyone could learn from. Obviously they promote facts which further their eurosceptic views but many are shockingly true.

 

Yes I have a look at the DM on a Saturday evening as they have some nice football pictures. I also read French newspapers which as I am sure you will know are far more regional and only tend to report facts at national level which allows one to make a more balanced opinion than having political propaganda thrust at you for whatever reason. You will also know that I am no lover of Mr Hollande, yet I can see his point when he asks why the UK should wish to interfere in the running of the Euro when it says it will never be a part of it. Cameron is trying to protect the City and Hollande is miffed because the UK will not join in with the FTT. Both have national interests at heart, rather more than Farage and Le Pen who are simply rabble rousing, trying to confuse economic problems with migration. There is more to this world than the UK alone, and unless nations try to get together to resolve problems things will only get worse.

 

The UK has every right to ensure that the Euro countries, who wish to rush into ever closer political and fiscal union, do not damage, intentionally or unintentionally the UK's interest. Hollande is more concerned with posturing and hoping to improve his feeble ratings ahead of his forthcoming election campaign.

The French and Germans would like to reduce the effectiveness of the city of London, any financial levy on share dealing would be bad news for financial institutions, mainly pension funds, in the UK.

The UK has every right to attempt to fashion the EU so as to reflect the original free trade area. Nobody in the UK has voted for the version of the EU as preferred by the technocrats. I doubt the majority in most of the EU countries want ever closer union.

Whether you like it or not Farage and Le Pen are very serious politicians supported by large minorities. Although they are not in power they are shaping policies by the governments in their respective countries. Immigration is probably the main concern amongst the population in Europe at the moment

You appear somewhat naive if you think the French, or any other member, are concerned about anybody other than their own national interests.

 

In my opinion the result of the referendum will depend on how the left votes on the issue. Corbyn has said that he will vote to stay in whatever the results are of negotiations, but it is unclear if this is a uniform left wing position. Times have changed radically since the EU. could be seen as a kind of block of the ravages of Thatcherism. It now has a much more neo liberalistic political orientation - the left have seen how Greece was bullied into selling off its national assets, and how TTIP is being pushed through without proper open debate. I want the UK. to stay in so that a future Labour government can renegotiate the important issues with Europe ie. strengthening of workers rights, ending of the ridiculous mantra of austerity (which no sensible economist believes in any longer), preventing the forced sale of public assets, extending real democracy, committing to real Co2 reductions - all of these things which matter far more than stirring up imaginary fears of European migration or protecting the fat cats of the city.

 

I think we will all be very old before we experience another Labour government, Thankfully Corbyn is working his socks off to ensure this.

 

Of course the UK needs to protect the City as so much of it's wealth comes from it. It has been known for a long time that the British economy is unbalanced with a reliance on banking and financial services. The problem with your stance SH is that so many of these services are sold to the countries of the EU and not to the countries that the UK could align itself with if it withdrew.

You appear to be very badly informed. Today I have seen the leaders of many countries within the EU talking about the migrant crisis. Yes the UK sideshow has come at an unfortunate time. These countries are trying to see what can help them as a union to sort the mess out. They have been slow to react as a unit which is why Germany has taken in so many, but I would rather the UK showed it's better side that does exist, than the blow you Jack I am alright that you constantly propose.

 

It's a deal.!!!!

The pantomime starts now.

 

These leaders have failed the migrants and their own populations. Safe havens should have been set up so the migrants could remain on their own continent. The UK were the only sensible ones to see the merit in preventing the carnage of mass migration. All your preferred policy does is to unfortunately strengthen the far right in each European country and enrich the smuggling gangs.

 

What is my preferred policy?

I am glad that a deal has been reached, although we wait to see the small print. Along with nearly all my English friends we are now registered to vote and there will be a massive postal vote. So Gove is likely to join the Out side. That should ensure that thousands of teachers will vote to stay in.