I have just listened to an interesting programme on radio 4 regarding the effects on a family due to the husband / father addicted to gambling. I have some personal experience as my father, otherwise a great dad, had a weakness for gambling which caused a certain amount of uncertainty and friction within the family. It can develop into a disease not unlike excessive alcohol or drugs. I'm not normally one to encourage the state to nanny us but I am concerned at the ease, due to new technology, in which punters can lose their money. I can imagine many of the people effected are the least able to afford the losses. I personally would prefer WFC to change its sponsor so the club does not in any way encourage gambling. Hopefully the government will also ban gambling ads connected to sport but maybe they take too much in tax from the sector to justify their intervention.
It's interesting. Following the tobacco advertising ban and the reluctance to embrace alcohol manufaturers as it could have been bad for the image of a club to have kids wandering round with Jonny Walker embalzoned on their chests many owners have now switched to the good old bookie. I do enjoy a punt but thankfully see it as more of a challenge and passtime than a way of making money (which is just as well if you look at my predictions and horse selections!). Unfortunately, many bookmakers (both high street and online) are now little more than glorified arcades and casinos with the percentage of profits inexorably switching from sports betting to those wretched machines. I must say pretty much anyone I know who has had any real gambling problem has hit trouble through said machines or card games rather than horses and football (not to say it's not an issue for some of course as i well remember being in bookies on a Friday afternoon and seeing blokes who'd slogged their guts out all week stick it behind the counter in minutes). Good luck with your desire to see betting alerts removed from our screens - I can't see it happening anytime soon as, apparently, gambling doesn't impact on people's health and cause a drain on the NHS. Of course this misses the human cost in terms of domestic violence, neglected kids, depressed spouses etc (I know we discuss smoking and its real evils on here but I've never known anyone beat up his wife or kids because he had 1 too many Bensons or lose the week's food money buying a pack of Rizzlas). That's not a party political point by the way as I think they all see it as a cash cow now. I actually agree with you about not wanting to be encuraging the nanny state but i do worry about the downward spiral being created. If it's to change it wonlt be achieved just by the Pozzo family. I wouldn't mind seeing all chairmen getting togther and determining whether a stand should be taken. In an ever increasingly competitive market with sponsors in short supply I cannot see it happening.
I tend to agree on this in as much as I would much prefer my club to identify itself with a more 'worthy' form of sponsorship. Having said that, once you start we are on a sticky slope because what is not 'moral' to me may be to you eg. I could have problems if my club was sponsored by one of those firms which is ploughing millions of tons of Co2 emissions into the atmosphere - for you the measure may be different. I would actually prefer that the clubs we watch have no sponsorship - as it was when I first became a fan. Of course if we do have sponsorship - then it should be from a workers cooperative !!!!!
I am pleased that the sponsorship doesn't appear on kids sized shirts at least. I am rather unsure about it. I have chosen not to buy any of the recent replica shirts, but I wouldn't call for a ban or anything like that. I do think the pervasiveness of gambling advertising in sport are making it appear like a normal thing everyone does all the time, when in reality for a lot of people gambling is limited to entering the office Grand National sweepstake. I especially dislike the "Live the Ladbrokes" life adverts, which make it seem like its part of normal social interaction to be constantly thinking about gambling on sport, or else you won't have any mates!
"you haven't lived unless you've stuck that deposit for a house on an outsider in the 3-40 at Lingfield".......
Interesting debate. My father liked a bit of a gamble on the horses and dogs and I can always remember sitting outside the bookies or sitting in the car whilst he drove to get a copy of the Evening Standard Classified so he could check the results - but he always gave his packet to mum first and she gave him back a few shillings for his baccy (half once of A1) and for the horses. Whilst I am not keen on bans, I would not be unhappy if we had a non-betting sponsor. I am concerned about the amount of adverts and sponsorships for all these betting companies and the impact of "normalising" this additional gambling on families. Fully agree with F1 about how these adverts and being portrayed - they are targeting the vulnerable.
Gambling, like alcoholism or drug taking, is not a disease. I personally don't mind a gambling company as a sponsor, I'd much rather them than McDonalds or Wonga. You can't blame pictures on shirts for your own weaknesses... No one should be buying replica shirts anyway (unless the tears of the poor bangledeshi children that make them feel smooth on your skin)
A recent study at Aarhus University Centre of Functionality Integrative Neuroscience showed that people who suffer from compulsive gambling have less self-control than healthy people, and this is related to changes in the brain. " For the patients it should be useful that we can now demonstrate that self-control is related to changes in the brain. This strengthens the view that this is a disease." Taking business away from workers in third world countries only damages the poorest in their society.
That quote proves nothing, if anything it's trying to excuse their behaviour. People need to be held accountable for their actions. I'm not even going to comment on that last sentence.
I once did some work with a charity that employed youth workers in the worst area of the town for violence, drug abuse and child negligence. It seemed that we might get some help with finding the money from the Lottery. Our youth workers were totally against the idea as in many cases the parents really did believe they could win a jackpot and would spend a large part of the house keeping money on tickets rather than feed and clothe the children. For many the Lottery is little more than a bit of fun, but others do not realize that the odds of winning are so high they might as well save the money which they cannot afford to lose, and yes the Lottery is gambling. I also think that the involvement of gambling in sport has lead to corruption amidst some players. Some of the small incidents that occur in sporting fixtures can be engineered by players who will accept money to do them. Not being a gambler I don't know much about spot betting apart from adverts I see on TV, but it seems it opens up all sorts of possibilities for fixing.
My dad was always in the betting office , no longer goes in as he is penniless . I have never been remotely tempted to place a bet or smoke ( he is also a life long chain smoker and is now suffering at end of life as a result ). If we lived in a fascist world and I were world leader I would happily place all bookmakers etc and peddlers of tobacco up against a wall and release the trigger . As an ex Baptist with attitude , I find it sad having to view a world full of adverts to tempt gamblers and the vulnerable . It's the kids of the feckless who suffer .
I've just remembered WFC recently had a payday loan company as sponsors, equally as bad in my view. I wonder if other clubs are more selective with their potential sponsors?
I think I'd much rather us have a bookmaker. But Toby does make a very valid point - there's a lot of companies whose morals you could question. I suppose it just depends on your own specific viewpoint and convictions as to whose logo you would and would not like to see emblazoned over your stadium and kit.
I agree with Toby. If we start to pick sponsors on the ethics of their products we would find few companies that some group or other did not object to. I hazard a guess that many more poor families waste money on mobile phones and internet access that they have no need for than on gambling. How many food, clothing, car, fuel and other companies are ethical.
Sometimes I think I simply have to accept that times change and that the notion instilled into me as a boy that gambling, and borrowing for that matter, was tantamount to sin is outdated. Then I look at the madness of the recent spree of lottery ticket purchases in the hope of winning £60m and I can only be grateful I know the pleasure of spending hard-earned money. Small bets for the fun of it I can understand, but queuing for a newspaper behind pensioners buying £25 worth of scratch cards saddens me. The finances of PL football clubs I gave up thinking too hard about long ago. I'd certainly rather we weren't sponsored by betting firms but it's the reality for now. The slot machines reminds me of driving up the coast of West Australia about 15/20 years ago. Even small remote hamlets had blacked out shop fronts, proudly announcing outside that they were Pokies. I was almost into Northern Territory before someone told me they were not brothels but slot machine gambling dens!
I was horrified when i saw the way they were workng in Melbourne 15 or so years back. No lights, no clocks and ATMs in the corner so people were pretty much in there till they had no cash left. Oddly, they have a state run betting organisation yet the machines all appear to be totally deregulated. I remember feeling quite pleased it wasn't so bad here yet now you can't turn on the telly without being given an offer you cannot refuse by Ray Winston or someone else!
Do Barcelona still have UNICEF on their shirts in place of a sponsor? That sort of advertising on shirts is good in my opinion. As has been said elsewhere most sponsors have dubious ethical merit. I don't gamble other than buying the occasional raffle ticket, but I would feel uncomfortable wearing a shirt with a bookie on the front.
Quick look at the EPL. I'm not sure many would have a problem with the airlines Emirates and Etihad, Tyre manufacturer Yokohama, electronics manufacturer Veho, insurance company Aviva, finance GWFX, software company Intuit Quickbooks, car manufacturer Chevrolet or Standard Chartered Bank. With the vast sums coming from the new Sky deal it is the perfect time choose a sponsorship partner that reflects our well earned family reputation. Our higher profile could, and should, produce an income much more than the current 1 million per year. Man U earn £53m, Chelsea £40m, Arsenal £30m per year. Due to the excellence and coverage of the smaller, less fashionable clubs this season the sponsorship gap looks excessive.
If I put my mind to it for a few minutes I am sure I could find reasons to question most of those companies. Oil, human rights regime abuse, banking, car pollution, exorbitant insurance that welch on pay outs - one person's good company is another's bad
