Match Day Thread Norwich V Saints 2/1/2016 KO 15:00

Crap?

 

Not saying he hasn't been. But it is the last thing we need is another player leaving and not being replaced.

 

Alright, we are pretty much on the same page then!

As I say, the reason why the focus is on Wanyama at the moment is (in my view) just because he's quite new to the group of poor performers. Generally speaking, the other poor perfomers have been poor for quite some time sadly! (But I'm not going to sit here and bore everyone to death by banging on about Fonte, for example, each week).

 

Everyone is allowed an opinion, none of us are right or wrong, I personally would have given Gaston longer, but we all see things differently.
When you awake in the morning you will have lovely sunshine in Dubai, we will wake to more rain, not as though I am envious

 

In the light of this latest defeat, I am going to put forward the idea that Saints were/are terrified of making that leap to the next level. As we know Cortese stretched our mindsets into thinking that we could make the CL. For that to have happened we needed a higher capacity, higher quality players with bigger salaries. The board and many on here weighed up the advantages and disadvantages and decided the risk was too great so we stopped going forward midway through last season and have obviously declined since then. If RK gets limited backing in the window, I feel he will call it a day, we get a mediocre replacement and relegation is the outcome.

 

Palace and Stoke will reach their ceiling and then regress, like us, and be replaced by upwardly mobile clubs like perhaps Derby and Boro if they make it out of the Championship! For 12 clubs in the PL thngs are cyclical, up and down the table, relegation and the bounce back if it is in the club's DNA like West Ham in our promotion season.

 

Here's one for you.

How about realising we will never make the next step up?

We are Southampton, max capacity 32000, a selling club with a ( currently) fantastic academy and scouting set up.

Selling players is a part of our revenue.

Look to build a stadium / improve the capacity of the current one by 10 - 15 thousand, it will not get filled.

Look to sign players on stupid wages? It will not happen.

We Are at best, in the current way of things, a mid table team, and I for one understand and accept that. This is all just my opinion though.

 

It's a hard thing to get right.

IMO, the board and KL are not exactly running off with gobs of cash. KL has put money into the team on a regular basis. But we are being run in a fiscally restrained manner so as to not accumulate further debt. It's quite possible our approach is too conservative.

But under Cortese we had ended up resorting to taking loans from Vibrac, which is never good. Which again, is not to slam Cortese or MP or anyone who has left, but what we were doing under them to me was not sustainable.

I think that if we finish 14th or 15th or something like that, the Board will make funds available. I mean, that's what you do-- you try to stay on a budget but with some rainy day funds available when you need them. The question is whether we can wait that long. Or exactly how much money we're going to need, as you don't want to panic and overspend on a bunch of crummy players out of panic.

We should have already prepared for the eventuality that Mane and Wanyama were leaving this summer anyway, so hopefully we have some targets in mind. If one of our targets becomes available in January, we might as well buy them now. You can't rely on the timing always being perfect where you find the replacement you want at exactly the time you are ready to sell.

 

There is a slight problem in that idea, good as it seems to sign new players. In the main, it is that we spent in the summer and came up with pretty much what we see before us now - players who are either warming the bench or are second or third choice starters covering. We can't afford or are not willing to pay the wages of decent players who can hit the ground running, and with the premium on transfers in in January, there's no reason why we'd choose now to bulk up with more of the same. Players aren't performing in part because there's **** all genuine competition for places in this team - imagine knowing you've got Steven Caulker vying for your place, as one example! Hardly inspires a performance (luckily we're covered for heart in that position).

I personally don't want this squad to get clogged up anymore with average players who are often no much more use than those training mannequins. Nor do I really want to change our transfer policy in terms of player profile, as I think it can work (eg. Virgil, or Clasie, who I just think unfortunately needs a season to adjust to this league, and who has shown imo that he will be a premium player once he has adjusted). The chances of getting anyone in who is halfway going to contribute more than we've got now is pretty slim. Of course, I also want signings in this window, but I just wonder what's the point?

 

Shhh you cant say things like that as otherwise you arent a supporter.

I agree btw. I think it is impossible for any club to make that next step without being taken over by Man City levels of money. There is quite simply no other away. Sustainability/gradual growth are just terms/strategies that do not work in football if you want to make it to the top level.

 

I think that what pisses me off the most is that there is poison running through the squad. Whether that is coming from Wanyama, Mane or whoever, we the fans will be the last or to never know.
The team spirit which Koeman had last season has all but disappeared, so who is to blame? Koeman / Read, the players?
I don't think the Wanyama saga helped in any way at the start of the season. IMHO this was one of the main reasons we went out of the Europa league when we did, and we haven't recovered since.
We have been very ordinary at home all season except for the Arsenal game.
I can understand why Koeman had stuck with the players up to now, but changes are needed.
Give Reed a run out in the team, Juanmi. If the bloke can't get a chance now, when will he? Romeu has to be given a chance (when not suspended) over Wanyama.
And for gods sake, buy a new bloody striker, which we should have done in the summer.
Oh, and let's get behind Koeman and trust him to rid the poison.

 

Actually, much as it pains me to say it, Spurs are a pretty good example of a club who has made that next step up, sustainably and over a prolonged period. You could argue that they have always been a level above us in terms of past success, revenue and profile, but I think it's their model we need to be emulating. Their board has come in for a lot of criticism because of their perceived reluctance to invest beyond their means, but over a period of time they have begun to look like an established top 6 side with serious top 4 aspirations - which are likely to be realised this season.

There's no reason why we shouldn't have similar aspirations to a club like Tottenham, but it's not going to happen overnight; it didn't for them either.

 

You are spot on BUT could we have made the next level if we had been wiling to sign higher calibre of players? They would command top notch wages but if the outcome had been positive, then it would have raised the club's profile to the next level and increased support. BUT it didn't happen so now we are on a downward curve that may flatten out.

 

One thing that Spurs have got that Saints don't and that is a much bigger fan base to start with. Same with West Ham and being major clubs in London will have no trouble filling their new stadiums. Saints have nowhere their level of support. Indeed London clubs syphon a considerabe support from the Hampshire area. Only way we can get that support is to win trophies on a regular basis. That is not in the SFC DNA.

 

One of the worst things about Saints losing is that I can`t be arsed watching MOTD, irrespective of how good the other games were.

 

Enjoy the ride boys and girls. We're going to have good years (like last year) and not so good years (like this one) and some terrible years. We won't win the Premiership unless some clever clogs finds ten 19 year old Messis during the summer break that won't be here the next year. Enjoy beating Arsenal 4-0, grieve momentarily losing to Norwich 1-0 and look forward to smashing Palace in the cup. We are Southampton, we are the Saints (and don't sack Ronald) COYR!!!

 

Boy. I'm disappointed today but not angry. Surprisingly.

I've just stopped reading the thread at page 14 because I started to wonder if the streams were very poor quality today, or if any of those posters were pissed at the game. I will read the rest later, but not now as I don't want to ruin my evening anymore.

My take is that it wasn't ( and we're not ) as bad as everyone made out. We had the better chances. We DID create, but you can't legislate for your striker heading and open goal over the bar (difficult yes, but factually correct), or for just making the wrong decision when in front of goal with just the keeper to beat. You can't legislate for your most creative player just not wanting to shoot when the chances were there.

Despite all I've read, I sat at the game today and felt we were comfortable all through the first 73 minutes and then from 77 minutes onwards. Our Cb's made a mistake each in the first half and although we didn't rip them apart in anyway, it was comfortable. Norwich looked poor. I posted at half time that it just looked like hey we're waiting for us to give it to them. We did. Or rather Vic did.

I thought Clasie did very well today.

I feel sorry for the manager today. Two "biggest" names let him down. Let us down. Let their team mates down. Let us fans down.

We are not really bad, but we are lacking clinical finishing and ruthlessness.

Tough times, but not as bad as some are saying. The board need to get us a striker. A proper one.

 

Nah Koeman's fault....