Don't get me wrong MM has done wonders for this club but I cannot buy into his philosophy on how the game should be played. I support Town but I go to matches for entertainment and Im not entertained. Regardless of how we end this season I can not see a situation whereby I feel I can justify or even want to spend 400 quid on a new season ticket. It wouldn't be easy to spend that kind of money regardless of circumstances but currently its not a situation Im even bothered about. As a fan from afar I would probably be happy with the results but these days I seem to endure rather than enjoy games. Its not only the style which I find difficult but the lack of variety in the play. we are a well oiled machine in many ways but machines are rarely fun.
" Under Mick we will not get out though, not good enough at the back, concede too many! " Ah but under Mick unlike Keane/ Magilton/ Jewell, we may make the play offs and have an opportunity to get there. We already have last season. Burley failed in the play offs, then again, then again, then up. Royle played lovely sexy footy and again failed in the play offs. Time will tell! " Regardless of how we end this season I can not see a situation whereby I feel I can justify or even want to spend 400 quid on a new season ticket. " This may be true in your case, but under Mick, after Keane and Jewell the average attendance went down year on year - last season is the first it's actually gone up in eight years. Should be a very decent gate boxing day vs Derby too. Very interesting debate this thread, quite enjoying it!
I do understand.. to an extent... those angry about the lack of quality at times, but I also see how effective our style has been. The Derby manager said how the game was one of the toughest so far this season. We have a stable team now that has been on a decent run, works hard for its manager, another season challenging for top 6 so there's many positives especially when you consider the mess we were in pre Mick and the limited resources compared to others. There's some that are totally anti Mick for whatever reason, which is fine, but it seems they're never going to be happy until he goes regardless of what's achieved. He's one of the most experienced managing in the Championship and knows what it takes to get teams up.
"Burley failed in the play offs, then again, then again, then up." I think that's a good point. Especially when there isn't endless funds to spend, it takes time to get it right.
With all due respect it is getting very tiresome that every time we have a debate about MM, our style of play or what tactics he employ someone always bring up Keane and Jewell and how bad it was It's all history now, and you don't get us MM detractors constantly bringing up BR and how good we were then Just thought I would mention it
Some people haven't been following the team as long as you yorkie. For some, this may be the best league position and most consistent they've seen us for quite some years plus the Sir Bobby years were much longer ago in a totally different football world than today. Some might just be a bit more accepting that the scene has changed and it's harder for clubs like us to compete than before. There are those who were lucky enough to witness those great times but I would say that's what it was...lucky. We have been very lucky to have had two great managers that brought success to our town but in general we are what we are, a rural town team that does enough to stay in the top two leagues. You'll also find enough posters who go on about 'the Ipswich way' etc because they have the memories of some great games and some great times.
Ah, Sir Bobby, packed heaving stands, exciting fast attacking play thru a creative middle, European footie, silky Dutch skills, careful, you will have me reaching for the hankie! I too have enjoyed this discussion - I am quietly confident that with several players returning, we shall see a zippier, more flowing Town brand. 3-1 against the Hoops! Onwards and upwards!
What you have said What you have said is,of course quite true, but I believe you have missed the point What I find tiresome is the fact that some only bring up selected history to try to win a point of view. Well we could all do that and it's very irritating, it's almost like saying we should be very grateful for what we have, and I don't accept that We should concentrate on the here and now and plan for the future and don't bring up the past whenever they feel they are losing the debate Never look back Merry xmas
Accepted mate, and understandable. The last time we were promoted it was with a manager that had several attempts and I hope the same happens if we stick by Mick a bit longer. We certainly haven't had much success changing the man steering the ship every couple of years. Merry christmas to you too mate,
Actually, when I think about it, our three most successful periods have all come when the manager has been given enough time to make it happen
Well it seems Evans is not going to fund buying a team in one go.....so it seems to me like we need to build a team over a few seasons that can take us forward.....it might not be Mick in the end, but I hope it is as I tired of starting over every two or so years (during the dark days that shall not be mentioned). Our brand of football is described by some as unentertaining.......but for me we are more often than not competitive and I enjoy watching competitive football....doesn't for me have to be silky fancydan stuff all the time not that I don't like the odd twist and turn and step over followed by a pin point pass, but I also enjoy a 50-50 ball or even 60-40 ball challenging for a header a last ditch tackle.....sometimes for me the ugly stuff can be entertaining I know it's not what Sky Sports want to hear.
Weighty, your right that a good, thunderous or last ditch tackle can be exciting and our competitive is not in question. The attributes we have are a welcomed quality but are also those that I naturally expect from all sportsman. Its always our workrate, effort, attitude that opposition managers praise. They are all 'natural' attributes that a lot of sportsmen seem to lack/ take for granted. My own take is its about brains aswell as brawn though. A last ditch tackle works wonders for the excitement level but if the next touch is a wallop 3/4s of the way up the pitch which the opposition picks up then its wasted. In many ways we need our workrate because we let the ball and the brain do so little work. On other points.Its not about expecting a short term fix. Building a team is fine but for me its the philosophy that is important and although this is likely to be subject to the players are your disposal in the early days I think it is safe to say given the turn around in playing staff that we have the general footprint of how MM wants us to play. Many of you will remember for a long time I supported PJ as although his reign was filled with errors it was one whereby I could see and agree with what he wanted to do. His philosophy on football was one I could buy into. He couldn't pull it off and it was right that he went but I feel that I was more patient with that era then I am with now. I went to games never knowing what was going to happen and never knowing if we were going to pull off a win or get destroyed by 5 or 6. These days I am fairly certain of everything that I will see. The starting line up. the style of play. the tactics, the subs. When you sit there and can name in advance where every long throw is going to go, where every goal kick will be aimed and how we will attack and defend all corners it takes away talking points. we used to have wide and varied post match threads. Part of that was down to pointing out our failures but also because we had discussion points. A standout display. a dazzling run, a commanding performance from someone bossing the midfield. These days we can log on and guess the replies to the threads. I suppose back onto the original subject, my ramblings have led me to conclude that I do not buy into a win at all cost ethos. Im not going to call for MM's head as he is succeeding (to a degree) but feel I will be happy to take a step back.
A well written post TB and there are many things to agree with in it. I especially liked this line... A last ditch tackle works wonders for the excitement level but if the next touch is a wallop 3/4s of the way up the pitch which the opposition picks up then its wasted.
Great post tractor bhoy,also agree with SD's point above.I am getting a bit hacked off with the attitude that if you don't like Mick's style then you are unrealistic in expecting so called champagne or sexy football.As with most things it's a question of getting a balance.You have to earn the right to play football by doing the dirty side of things well,then you can set up the more attractive attacking side of play.We have always had players proficient in that aspect from Bryan Hamilton,through Talbot,to Wark, Holland and presently Skuse.The trouble with Mick's philosophy is the game doesn't develop from there.
That's a fair point Bigal, it's the same the other way round too that those that accept Micks Style are thought to be happy with mediocrity. No matter what anyone says nobody knows if we will get promotion under Mick but also if we would be better off under someone else....we could bring someone in that tries to play total football and we end up going down. As I've said before I hope Mick gets us up.....but if he is replaced I will lend my support to whoever is in the job.
Touché, Weighty.Personally I have always expressed the opinion that if we are going to stay in this Division or just scrape into the playoffs I would prefer it was by playing a more attractive brand of footie-perhaps that's me also settling for mediocrity!!
Tough question, great thread to read. For me, the how we get the ball into the opposition net isn't a problem. Never has been. In some ways a striker bearing down on goal after picking up a 'hoof' can get me out of my seat faster then passing it around the opposition half for 5 minutes in an attempt to get the perfect goal. And losing out on a long ball is less groan inducing then a misplaced pass after otherwise exciting build up play. What I can agree with though is frustration at the predictability of the game which can flatten any excitement. The seemingly endless hope that we will be more flowing when a player comes back/next season. Always wondering what happens to the exciting play of young wingers we bring in during the summer. And of course when the game is lost the consolation of we played well isn't there. Again, games I get to watch either on TV or live are few and far between and I understand ticket money is payed for entertainment but I find it very hard to criticise a manager that up to now has improved our league position year on year.
For me at the moment I just want to see us get promoted by hook or by crook. It would help our finances out no end and give us the means to become the team and play the football we'd really like to see. Stoke are a great example, got promoted with route one football and have slowly morphed into a good team playing some decent stuff now.
