Off Topic Political Debate

Slightly harsh I think Aberdeen - I tend to think the party ripped itself to pieces over Europe and combined with the corruption issues presented victory on a plate to Blair. Admittedly i am biased on Major as I always thought he was a better PM than he ever gets credit for - had it not been for his courage in opening negotiations with Sinn Fein Mr Blair would never have been able to tell us it wasn't time for soundbites but he could feel the hand of history on his shoulder

 

Benn, Foot and now Corbyn may have strong principles in common, but they equally share an unsuitability to run the UK or even a political party.

I cannot see Corbyn lasting a year.

 

i think he'll get an election but the point is we can respect people for their political views if they are consistent and honorable, it doesn't mean one remotely agrees with those views.

 

Point well made but I am not sure Corbyn will survive to an election. Both Thatcher and Blair outlived their ability - both came to believe they were too important Thatcher thought she was Queen and Blair President. Major was OK but not especially a man of principle; more boringly consistent (Spitting Image's grey man).

 

800 pump-action shotguns seized by Italian police at Trieste port from Turkey en route for Belgium. Controls had been stepped up due to Paris attacks.

 

It'd be interesting to know how many illegal AK47s are already in circulation in Western Europe, I'd bet it's in the thousands with less than 10 in the UK.

 

As Oscar Wilde once said, there is only one thing worse than being talked about and that is not being talked about. Surely he is the most 'talked about' person on here - even more so than the PM. What most of you seem to forget on here with the discussion on 'how long will Corbyn last' is that he was once 200 to 1 against for being elected the Labour leader ! Do you expect that the way the Labour party is made up is going to change overnight - that the 180,000 who voted for him are going to go away ? Or that they will tolerate any coup from above - none of that. My belief is that he will still be leader in 2020, my only real doubts are 1. can he 'come over' without the media on his side and 2. Will he still have the energy for all this going well into his 70s ?

 

Not into betting, but I believe you can get very short odds on him being replaced as leader in 2016.

 

He was elected because he was different from the other grey candidates. He was also elected because of the rule changes bought in by Miliband, which has back fired. The 180k who voted for him are less important than the vast majority of MP's and more importantly the Labour voting public.

If he carries on with his gaffes, bad by election result and May elections (if he lasts that long) then I don't mind him being their leader in 2020. I cannot believe their non union financial backers will tolerate such a loser.

 

You are still obsessed by Corbyn aren't you. I would take issue on just one thing here - 'the 180,000 who voted for him are less important than the MPs' - this tells us a lot about yourself, the Conservatives, and your conception of Democracy. How can a party govern in a democracy if it is not itself democratic ? Who was it who got those MPs into power ? In the end the electorate but initially they were selected as candidates by their constituency parties - who can, in the end, non select them or completely boycott their election campaigns. They are the party - not the MPs. though it does not surprise me to see a Tory taking a more elitist view.

 

What will proved soon at the by election, maybe earlier, is the view of some of the 9.5 million who voted for Labour candidates not neo communists who have declared their interest in bringing down the capital system. It is not for me to decide the fate of these temporary unrepresentative leaders it will be the voters, as it should be. You talk of grass roots politics, you will plainly see soon they don't like your brand of socialism, true democracy.

You will probably dismiss the rejection of Corbyn's policies by the electorate as manipulation by the media instead of just being lousy.

 

Have you still not noticed that his "gaffes" are completely made-up falsehoods from the Tory media circus?

 

I must say I have a lot of respect for this man. He is a quaker who lives by his conscience.


I must also say I have more respect for him than the sensationalist divisive media that seek to discredit him.

 

This is a bit rich. Corbyn is the new leader of the government's opposition - I think he is in an important enough role to be discussed isn't he? Of course 180,000 people like you and me are far less important than nine and a half million Labour voters PLUS millions of others like myself who might want to vote Labour but could not consider voting for them under Corbyn. You have a weird skewed view of the importance of party members Cologne -one that nobody else on here seems to share. The MPs WERE selected by their constituency party members and their selection has not been revoked so they can legitimately claim to speak for the members you so revere. They also speak for their electorate. Our democracy is NOT run by party activists but by ordinary people. NOw we begin to see the threat of de-selection coming to the fore - I wondered how long that would take. This is more like a putsch than democracy.

 

There you go again.....anyone who doesn't agree with your World view is a Communist, now we are beginning to know what McCarthyism must have been like. It's like debating with someone from the flat Earth society !

 

Really - do the media invent the images we see and the reporting where I watch Labour MPs and members of the shadow cabinet saying things? This is another leftist tactic - try to discredit your enemies by inventing Tory media circus tales. That to me is the falsehood. Again I say this as a neutral not a Tory.

As I have said many times I respect his principles but not his Quaker beliefs as they are no more valuable than other religious and non religious beliefs and have no relevance. The media are of course loving it - you and Canary I seem to remember enjoyed the sensationalist lies (no proof was ever offered) about Porky Cameron. It is hypocritical to claim that one set of media lies are worse than another isn't it?

 

The excuses have already started.

 

Leo...it is the party members who have the right to make party policies (right or wrong) are you disputing that ?

 

Leo, I like and respect you, but have you failed to notice all the stories about him wishing Sadam had nit been killed, about him not bowing at the Cenotaph and all the other lies and half truthes taken out of context?

 

wrong

It is the national executive committee. They currently endorse the replacement of Trident, take notice Corbyn.