At the start of the season there were arguably four teams considered title contenders. Three of them are in the top 4. Only Chelsea have failed to challenge. The assertion that "the title contenders haven't shown up this season" is head up arse stuff as you're only thinking of Chelsea. The other three have all shown up! It's as myopic as your insistence last season that United's defence was awful based on one keystone cops performance against Leicester which was largely down to a daft formation and a number of injuries. You consider it an "odd, odd season". City have one less point than they had last season. Southampton were third so basically doing a bit of a Leicester. This season isn't much different to most seasons. The only thing that's odd about it is Chelsea are not doing very well. For the rest of us it's normal, hence head up arse! By the way, someone like United might sneak a title? We have form for winning the league!
Arsenal are on a downward spiral, with the injuries they have, they aren't going anywhere but down. This isn't odd I concede, as its somewhat the norm now for Arsenal. City getting hammered at home by a midtable team is weird, no? I have watched them play this season and they look very inconsistent. Unlike Chelsea though, they have still been grabbing points. Chelsea being in relegation form despite being Champions. Leicester being top of the league. City and Arsenal have both lost 3 games already, and Chelsea 7!! and we are only 13 games in to the season. No one is running away with it. Maybe in the new year we will see 2 or 3 teams break away from the pack, which is what usually happens. United's defence was bad last season, come on, they completely changed the way they played after that Leicester game, far less free flowing and more reserved. LvG's success will hinge on rediscovering the balance Fergie had down so well in allowing free flowing attacking football, without Forrest Gump defending at the back. Difference was Fergie had personnel like Rio and Vidic to work with, who were world class defenders.
The Leicester game was our 5th game of the season. After that we had one of if not the best defensive records in the league. You spent the majority of the season banging on about how **** our defence was, based largely on the fact that you think Smalling and Jones are crap (United have never lost a game when those two have started as the two centre halves). I can recall discussing this with you several times and pointing out that our defence wasn't the issue, we had bigger problems with our attack. That's still the case today. It's an odd season for Chelsea. It's odd for Leicester as well. However in general it's all pretty normal. The league doesn't revolve around Chelsea being title challengers.
Your attacking personnel is fine. You have great attackers. You have Wayne Rooney, Juan Mata and Bastien Schweinsteiger in your team ffs. All excellent players. The reason they are not scoring is because of the style of football United are playing to make up for the ****e defence. It's working, your defensive record is great. But you cannot score for ****. But you are telling me the attacking personnel you have aren't good enough? Pull the other one. City and Arsenal have lost 3 games already, in 13. Most of the time Champions lose less than 5 games in a whole season, and we are not even half way through......it's odd!
OK so by "odd" what you mean is more competitive and/or that City, Arsenal and Chelsea aren't as good as they were last season? That's not odd, that's normal, teams improve/decline from one season to the next. We've only lost 2 games, Spurs have only lost 1. If either Spurs or United win the league because they managed to lose the fewest games why would that be odd? You may not like it but it wouldn't be odd. It would mean that the best team had won the league. Where did I say that we didn't have the attacking personnel? You can pull whatever you like but I didn't say that. You clearly base a team's defensive or attacking capabilities solely on which personnel they have. Smalling and Jones = ****e therefore United's defence = ****e. Rooney, Mata and (bizarrely) Bastian = great therefore United's attack = great. It isn't that straightforward.
No its not that simple, if they are being utilized wrong. Smalling and Jones ARE ****, but are being utilized correctly, and the defensive performances show this. Your attackers are very good, but are not being utilized correctly, the attacking performances show this. Because LvG is compensating for the crud defensive personnel, the attack is suffering. And to answer your first question, yes I mean its that Arsenal, City and Chelsea aren't as good as last season. Which was my original point. For the top 3 teams from last season all to take a dip (or a plunge in our case ) is odd. Not quite sure why you are arguing about this. And yes if Spurs and United won the league losing less than 5 games that wouldn't be odd (Well Spurs winning the league full stop would be odd ).....not quite sure what you are getting at in that respect, when i am talking about City, Arsenal and Chelsea.......
City have one less point than at the same stage last season. Arsenal have 6 more. How does that make them that much worse than last season, particularly Arsenal? You're just lumping them in with Chelsea to make it seem like it's not just Chelsea who have imploded. It is. If you genuinely think that Smalling and Jones are ****, particularly Smalling, then you really should just stick to a dialogue with Astro.
I thought the points analogy was ****. And that we should put no truck in it? It is only Chelsea have that imploded, I haven't stated anything other than that. In fact I predicted it before the season started. I really am not sure what point you are trying to make. It's odd that City get mullered at home to a midtable team, Arsenal are plagued with injuries and Leicester are top of the league......its a funny season. When most expected Chelsea and City to be battling for the title. Now United and shockingly, Leicester, have gotten involved and Chelsea are near the relegation zone. And yes, your defenders suck copious amounts of balls........vigorously.
I think you're arguing for the sake of arguing Stan! I have to agree that it is an odd season to find a side like Leicester top and the champions closer to relegation. When was the last time that happened? Plus the likes of Palace and West Ham over achieving. Though I would say I think Smalling has been much better this year so credit to him. How much of that is down the LVG placing more emphasis on disciplined dare I say cautious approach is of course open to debate.
I think my initial "teams like Leicester and United are in with a shout" comment riled him. Like he thought I was lumping them in together in terms of stature and prestige, that wasn't what i was saying at all. And I think now he is committed to the argument, he doesn't want to back down, despite there not really being anything to argue about. He seems to be thinking that i am also saying City and Arsenal have imploded like Chelsea, which I also never said anything of the sort. Just that they are not on their A games right now.
Arsenal are certainly better than they were at this stage last season. No idea why you think or can justify otherwise.
Not really an indicator, they have 6 more points than at this stage, but hadn't played the same 13 teams, a better way would be to look at the corresponding fixtures. Regardless, my point was that Arsenal look dodgy at the moment, they lost, they have a gazillion injuries, and I cannot see them sustaining a title challenge as things are.
My opinion that they are better is not really an indicator? I said they are certainly better than they were last season. I think that is the case whether you agree or not!
Not sure why you would think that is. Have they performed better after 13 games than they did last season, maybe....marginally. They bought not a single outfield player, and now their squad is decimated, as it is every year, by injuries. Doesn't bode well. Arteta is awful, they need a new DM and a striker, and have done for about 3 seasons, but Wenger is too stubborn to buy the required players. Hence why yo-yoing between 3rd and 4th is the best they can hope for. Cech was a great buy, since they hadn't had a decent keeper since Seaman really. And they never replaced Van Persie either. Giroud is a decent player, and I would certainly have him as a squad player at Chelsea, he will grab you 10-12 goals a season. But he is not good enough to spear head a title winning attack, and certainly not a team competing for the CL.
Yes they've played better than last season and are a better team with Cech in goal. The injuries may hamper them from now on but up until this point they have improved on last season's performances and results. Nothing odd about that.
Not in the C.L they haven't. They could go out tonight. Normally they at least get last 16. As Bo said, odd season.... Add to that, relatively unknown Jamie Vardy being top scorer and equalling legend RVN's record.
It's odd for you guys. Don't project your oddness onto the rest of us. The only club that might embrace your odd ethos is Leicester.
What is odd is that our **** defence concedes so few goals when world class defences concede an average of almost two a game. That's either odd or the people who consider it odd don't know what they're talking about. We've been odd for years. The amount of titles we won by being **** is extraordinarily odd.
