The government is certainly in for a rough ride over the referendum and the responsible attitude it is taking over eventually reducing the national debt. However so far the government is popular with a rating of 42% compared to Labour's 27%. Thankfully one thing is for certain is that the country does not want your kind of left wing policies. If in the unlikely event of the Tories ripping themselves apart then Labour need to be ready with an electable team. This seems impossible at the moment.
Haven't you finally worked out yet that the 2 parties need each other like Celtic and Rangers do ? If the one party split then the other one would soon after - both parties have only managed to maintain solidarity over the years because of fear of the opposition. Without a strong Labour Party which has some chance of gaining power, the Tories would split in about 3 groups. The same thing exists in the other direction it is the existence of the Tories which holds the Labour Party together. My guess is that both parties would break up in the event of a PR. type election.
I guess you are talking to my ignored member I think it is so much more productive to discuss the issues in hand. Clearly both main parties are split over this issue in the UK. Here is a challenge. Can we discuss the issues rather than falling into party politics? Main issues for me at this juncture: The economy this will include Britain's role outside of the Euro Banks Trade Relationships with Non-EU Defence to include Europe/Nato The borders etc Travel and immigration The environment Culture etc anybody fancy helping me with this?
Your problem is a PR type of election is never going to happen so we are left with the Tories or Labour (as long as they can find an electable leader).
I'm not with you as you know on this Yorkie. Not sure if it is your Headmaster background ( a bit controlling ? - no offence intended) but you seem to want to control how other people think and speak. Some of us like a bit of banter - even wumming - I have not found it necessary to "ignore" anyone specifically. Some of us like party discussions and debating left and right even if we do not know what those terms really mean. Let people be - all your good suggestions for discussion can take place without any of us needing to moan about another person's debating style. I answer only points I think people have made well - a silly or snide comment simply passes me by. We all have different styles
Each to their own... I have very little interest in left/right banter as for me it gets nowhere and people get abused. This has happened and i have been in correspondence with two ex members of this message board who have felt this and left which is ... dare ...I say .....sad..... Your yourself have returned after the event and perhaps looking at it from outside don't see it. For me political parties and politicians take a position which is by its very nature partial. I just welcome discussing issues without being marginalized into a category I do not myself inhabit. The EU is a case in point as different factions in different parties hold opposing positions. Therefore surely it is possible to discuss the issues without resorting to party politics?
And there is me thinking this is a political thread!!! Political news coverage is 95% party political so maybe not unusual to find some on this thread? I'm sure there will be strong views expressed on the referendum as we get nearer the date although there is no excuse for abuse.
As you say : each to their own. Why then tell other people how to argue and what to argue about. I am sorry if anyone quit this board due to others. AndyTopRankin left because of me and I hate that. However for those who do not like religion and politics being discussed it is perfectly possible to choose which threads you read and take part in. I did see somebody claimed Bolton left because of the Scottish Referendum debate. That appeared odd as the referendum was last September and he left in June I think. I cannot see how you can discuss politics and NOT involve parties - they are integral. Many points can be made without referring to parties but if a person wants to praise or blame a party or its leader then they should be allowed to. On a personal note I think that some of the comments made about Cameron, Osborne and Thatcher on here together with newspaper cartoons and photos have been amongst the worst examples of discussion on here. These people are voted for by many millions of honest people and whether or not you agree with them or like them it is not pleasant to make some of the derogatory remarks that are made. At least Corbyn takes most criticism for his political beliefs. I do not like many politicians nor many political parties but I try to show respect for them and not imply they are corrupt and paid for by cronies simply because they choose a different path to the one I might take However if I don't like it I can stick to the football threads - like so many on here do.
Yes Cologne often abuses Thatcher and Tories in general but he's quite a harmless sort of fellow. He's just a bit confused about UK politics.
Yes - and you enjoy winding people up - hence why Yorkie has you on ignore - but apart from the fun you get you must realise that it degrades any serious arguments you do make
I would rather be part of a group that has good banter together and can discuss issues respectfully. Clearly if someone leaves then there is an issue. This message board and going back to 606 days was always welcoming and friendly. This is really in danger of being lost. Funny all I asked was can we discuss issues ......
My comments reflect serious dialogue but there is nothing wrong with a bit of banter. There does seem to be a lack of sense of humour with some posters. I can fully understand why some socialist supporters are a little embarrassed and would prefer to talk about anything else.
I will have a go at this one Yorkie. Britain's role outside of the Euro - Trading in carrots and flint ! Banks - End to privileges of the City of London, Transaction Taxes, more nationalization of banks. Trade - Buy more British/more subsidies for organic farming. Raise disposable spending power of population. Relations with Non EU. - Stop TTIP ! Defence/Europe/NATO - Leave NATO, scrap Trident, work more closely with European partners and stop just complaining from the sidelines. The Borders - I like Border Collies/bring back Offa's Dyke. Travel/Immigration - We need facts and figures on this and not scaremongering/We always have an open door for young nubile women from all countries. Environment - Vote Green, Transition town networks, send all global warming deniers to Luton for a year. Culture - Cloth caps forever ! Is that everything ?
Trust you I'm with Yorkie in that there is definitely a discussion to be had on the pros and cons of leaving and staying and I hope it will all come out on here at some point as I totally agree with Leo that when people actually discuss issues with each other it's fascinating reading. Unfortunately issues like Schengen and the associated security implications will inevitably dominate for now. This is not a pop at anyone on the forum but I don't think the debate should necessarily be purely on party political lines as, aside from UKIP, you'll probably have people on both sides of the argument in all parties - to varying degrees obviously!
Europe is going through one of those stages that individual countries face from time to time. Policies are being re-examined to see if they are fit for purpose, and from what I read in the French press many will move towards the UKs view rather than the opposite. Change within the EU is slow because of it's structures, but change will take place eventually and by the time the people have their say there could be different models for some of the regulations in place.
