I'm not a Muslim, although I'm certainly not offended by your assumption. And I have described the Paris atrocities as heinous above. The cowards who perpetrate such abhorrent acts deserve the condemnation of people everywhere from all countries, faiths and politics. My point is that when I see people attacking all Muslims for the actions of such a tiny minority, I understand how that hatred could only drive more and more disaffected young Muslims into the hands of extremist clerics and simply turn the wheel further and further. Hate the acts and those that kill so terribly, but be careful not to inflame the problem even more by branding the many, many millions of peaceful, true Muslims as terrorists.
The way people are talking, you'd think that the atrocities happened in the UK while the Muslim Council just shrugged. I have read that the intelligence agencies have quashed quite a few plots. I'm guessing they would have needed some help to narrow down the two or three million Muslims into a list of suspects especially since everyone considers it such a closed off community. I've also read how devastated parents are when their kids have fled to Syria. This would suggest that there isn't the level of sympathising or turning of cheeks that people would believe. Also, whenever there's a gun rampage in USA in the name of a Christian God, you don't hear the Christian community saying that they will do everything in their power to help root out those who interpret the bible ro their own twisted ends. Seems to me that the Muslim community needs to do more than everyone else just to be considered level by those that are waiting in the wings to hate them.
Why should some criticism "drive more and more disaffected young Muslims into the hands of extremist clerics"? I can take criticism without wanting to go and kill people who don't believe what I do. This is precisely what I was describing in an earlier post..............apologising for terrorism. All faiths have their extremists. All faiths have their problems. The Islamic faith must face up to their problems and people apologising for them doesn't help when they forever claim to being victimised as it is.
Do you have any evidence to show that the Muslim Council have given any actual help to the intelligence services or are you just "guessing"? An awful lot of intelligence is gathered due to brave men and women from the intelligence service working in incredibly dangerous and treacherous circumstances. Christian extremists are just as evil imo.
I don't hate Muslims. I hate the way they do not integrate with our culture. I hate the way many of their woman are treated. I hate the way that due to the way multiculturalism and political correctness have been manipulated, anyone speaking negatively about Islam is branded racist and / or Islamophobic. Most of all I hate the way that some (maybe even a minority) of them use the freedom of speech (so preciously won as we remembered last Wednesday) and our laws to plainly work the system to their advantage while they propagate their message of hate (Abu Hamza especially), knowing that if they 'win', that freedom of speech will be the first thing to go. By and large this has been an interesting and thoughtful debate. I am sure we can all agree the issues are complex and there are no simple answers. However, action needs to be taken now at Government level to address some of these issues. A good start would be giving the authorities greater power to search and seize / arrest. So often, it appears, the police know who / where the bad guys are but just can't prove it. If we are at war, as President Hollande has declared, surely the rules of engagement are different? Not a popular view or is it?
Well, the percentage of Christians in the US is about 80%, Muslims in the UK about 5% so a more manageable number to influence. But the answer is that rather than blame innocent people of any faith, we have to be highly intolerant of intolerance. Hate preachers should be prosecuted, faith schools should be monitored to ensure bigoted ideology is not being taught, those who have been involved in plots have to be heavily overseen if not locked up. We've all grown up and know that where extremist or criminal behaviour occurs, it is not racist for the police or security services to pull suspects in for investigation. The authorities will, as always, be accountable if they make mistakes or overstep their authority
I'm just "guessing" in the same way people "guess" nothing is done in the way of help. However, given that everybody considers Muslims so insular, it seems more logical to "assume" that either help is given, there are undercover Muslims working for our intelligence or both. My point about Christian extremism (equally disgusting but less prevalent currently) is that nobody can "guess" one way or the other if the Christian community helps because there aren't the same calls to be seen acting just to appease others.
I'm more than happy to forego our rights to data privacy to make the country safer. You are right though, stronger Government helps in terms of sacrificing a bit of freedom for the greater good.
No problem with any of that except that I'd hope that either group would do the right thing without needing to be influenced.
Me too mate. My browsing history is pages and pages of this website, a chess website, items of professional interest and then random items of general interest. Have it all and knock yourself out!
I'm not. We need to be careful here that in protecting our civil liberties from terrorism we undermine them ourselves. I am sure that would please the terrorists. We went through two major wars against formidable enemies without doing so (with limited and temporary amendments). Once you give up some rights to privacy you may struggle to get them back. I don't think this approach reflects the traditional relationship in English law between the state and the people.
Fortunately, we don't have too many active white supremacists in the uk. There was a young KKK member that shot black worshippers in the south US about 6 months ago. He will never regain his liberty
Great post but have we ever faced an enemy that fights in this way before i.e. the enemy from within?
unfortunately we will have many more atrocities like this, we won't escape it here in England either. Thoughts go to all Parisians at this sad time
Good question. I went to a C of E school. Learned about C of E but no other religion. C of E bishops are bunch of scoundrels anyway
I think you might be surprised at how many active 'white supremacists' we actually do have in the UK.
