That was to catch Vettel though, rather than cover off suspected penalties. If they were worried about the engine at the time they'd have settled. On deflate-gate mark 2, I think Mercedes have got away with it based on a legal argument, rather than because the pressures were fine. It sounds like the regulations don't quite specify the conditions for the test, and Mercedes have argued the tyres were fine in the conditions tested. The tyre blankets being off is a funny one though, do we know which set of tyres were tested? Was it simply tested before they started heating tyres pre-race?
I think they normally would have settled for third but decided to push the engine to try and clear Vettel and get 25s ahead of the Williams boys. I doubt they would admit this as it would now be seen as pointless.
Italian GP: Why were Mercedes not punished? BBC F1 pit lane reporter Tom Clarkson explains why Mercedes were not punished despite a stewards' investigation over tyres. Mercedes were investigated on the grounds the tyres were below the minimum permitted pressure. But the stewards allowed Lewis Hamilton to keep his victory after ruling Mercedes had followed safe operating procedures.
I think they were very lucky. From what was said tyres had to be at minimum pressure at all times.When checked on grid Mercs were under. Mercs argument was something like 'we set the tyres at the minimum pressure and Pirelli tech checked them. Then we fitted them in garage. Somehow when we got to the grid the tyres pressures were lower!' I think they were so very lucky, my guess is the stewards thought if they disqualify Merc then Ferrari would win their home gp and that would look like way too much favouritism even for FIA!!!
Another FIA testing balls up really. If you don't specify everything to the last degree then it is open to interpretation/exploitation. If Mercedes' explanation was that the Pirelli engineer approved them then I don't think you can penalise Mercedes. The FIA put themselves in a position where someone had to decide who was in charge of administering the rules, Pirelli or the FIA. And they hadn't thought there might be a conflict between the two.
The FIA were at fault. Not Mercedes. Unfortunately, there are times the FIA appear not to consider the most basic consequences of vagueness. This is particularly true when there have been 'knee-jerk' reactions in the past. With regard to tyre pressures, it should be obvious that any testing be carried out at a precise time, relative to the start of the race, since usage of the tyre around the circuit will vary from driver to driver and can make a significant contribution to any such measurement. As has already been alluded to in the thread, tyre pressure is a difficult science involving all manner of variables. It is therefore vital that any adjustment of, or redefining of regulations with regard to tyres be absolutely clear. It was not. All it needs is proper consideration of what is being stated before any such redefining of a rule is made. In this instance, I would suggest Jean Todt is out of his depth in either not understanding the implications of changes in regulations, or not recognising the importance of precise definition, or not ensuring basic proof-reading occurs (as generally did under Max Mosley) if, as usual, he chooses to delegate this responsibility. In my opinion, the FIA have once again demonstrated incompetence…
The whole thing is very very simple. When they put the air into the tyres, they were at a certain temperature. When they tested them on the grid, they were at a lower temperature. It's scientific fact that if the same amount of air is in the tyres, then at a lower temperature, the pressure will be less. Hamilton's tyres were a bit cooler when tested than in the garage, hence the pressure was a bit lower. Rosberg's were a lot cooler. All those things being facts, there is no way that Mercedes can be punished. Unless you want to DQ them for turning the tyre blankets off, which is, you know, crazy. Chalk this one up to the FIA not knowing basic science. In the future, they will have to specify a temperature at which pressure measurments should be taken.
Did anyone hear Anthony Davidson's explanation on SKYF1? He was saying that the moisture in the air in the tyres together with heat makes the pressure change!!!! I thought that all F1 teams nitrogen to fill tyres so that they don't get moisture and other uncontrollable elements in the tyres?
Just need to use a bit of PV = nRT So if they were ok at 110 Celsius. Ham was 0.3psi under so his T potentially was 104c Ros was 1.1psi under so his T was 88c Physics!
That's a vast difference and doesn't make sense. To me it would indicate that the difference in Lewis's tyres was an error but Nicos was a deliberate calculation.
I had to crack out a calculator and everything At 19.2psi the temp was 104.1077c At 18.4psi the temp was 88.3949c Using the theory of P1V1 = P2V2 T1 -------- T2 Assuming V didn't change T's in kelvin T Ham = (19.2*383)/19.5 T Ros = (18.4*383)/19.5 A quick google tells me that when V is constant that's just called Gay-Lussac's law.
So I guess if the numbers Tom Clarkson said in the video were actual readings then both the Mercedes boys would have tyres just about 19.5psi at 110c... all good
You are correct about the use of nitrogen. However, there is a misconception that this gas is inert. It is not. Oddly enough, it is not one of the Noble Gases and it does react with oxygen – which becomes more prevalent with moisture. It should also be clear from the discussion following the events of today that nitrogen is also affected by heat (although once again, this is negligible when compared against ordinary air). Although the relative effect upon nitrogen in both cases is minimal when compared with air, in the exacting world of F1, humidity and temperature can and do play a significant part upon the contents of a tyre which ideally would not be exposed to either! Perhaps a more significant factor is that moisture in the air has a cooling effect upon a tyre's surface through evaporation since they are exposed to the atmosphere. Thus the pressure of nitrogen inflated tyres tend to be affected more by external circumstance (including temperature) than what is inside.
Balls... forgot to vote. Is it too late to say Hamilton? Apologies for my recent lack of contribution btw... Had a few things going on that have had me a tad distracted. Hope to get back in to the habit of posting again soon.
