1. Log in now to remove adverts - no adverts at all to registered members!

Grand Prix thread Italian Grand Prix 2015

Discussion in 'Formula 1' started by cosicave, Sep 2, 2015.

?

blow the bloody doors

Poll closed Sep 4, 2015.
  1. Hamilton

    77.8%
  2. Rosberg

    16.7%
  3. Vettel

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. Raikkonen

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. bottas

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  6. massa

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  7. grosjean

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. ricciardo

    5.6%
  9. perez

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  10. other.

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. BrightLampShade

    BrightLampShade Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Messages:
    13,495
    Likes Received:
    2,568
    Toto Wolff: "It wasn't a mistake by the team"

    NOT disqualified for low tyre pressure. OK when fitted to the car. Temps were down when measured

    Mercedes team showed data to reveal that tyres were at the correct pressures when fitted to the car. Hence the 'not guilty' verdict.



    So then internet.... explode!
     
    #181
  2. eddie_squidd

    eddie_squidd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2011
    Messages:
    2,737
    Likes Received:
    2,369
    I guess that answers my question!
     
    #182
    dhel and taeleon like this.
  3. Smithers

    Smithers Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2011
    Messages:
    8,233
    Likes Received:
    811
    Principly wrong.
     
    #183
  4. BrightLampShade

    BrightLampShade Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Messages:
    13,495
    Likes Received:
    2,568
    please log in to view this image




    I'll wait for this to blow over before commenting more. It all depends on the proof each side had. Guilty is nailed on DSQ. Seems Mercedes have proved they did it in the proper manner but then blah blah blah it gets messy :/
     
    #184
  5. taeleon

    taeleon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2011
    Messages:
    492
    Likes Received:
    330
  6. Smithers

    Smithers Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2011
    Messages:
    8,233
    Likes Received:
    811
    Considering teams leave their tyre blankets on for as long as possible I find it strange that they would unplug and allow the temperature to drop (and associated pressure) as a usual procedure - unless their was a calculated reason!

    Pirelli alluded to this with their recommendations
     
    #186

  7. taeleon

    taeleon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2011
    Messages:
    492
    Likes Received:
    330
    But wouldn't they risk a bad start with low tyre temps then? Also I thought the Pirelli thing was telling teams not to use blankets that are too hot as more heat = more pressure to allow them to start them lower and cover it up?
     
    #187
    fevriul likes this.
  8. EternalMSC

    EternalMSC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    10,624
    Likes Received:
    747
    Bullshit like their illegal tyre test in '13.
     
    #188
    u408379965 likes this.
  9. BrightLampShade

    BrightLampShade Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Messages:
    13,495
    Likes Received:
    2,568
    It's remarkably similar when you think about it. On both occasions they had done something so cut and shut wrong. On both occasions they had documentation from officials from before the action saying all was ok. If only we had a conformation from Charlie Whiting we'd have 3/3 <ok>
     
    #189
  10. BrightLampShade

    BrightLampShade Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Messages:
    13,495
    Likes Received:
    2,568
    So then, what's the betting that Rosbergs engine went boom because he to had to push in the closing laps to try and get 25s in front of cars behind? All for nothing as well. The Williams pair finished 22-23s behind Vettel.
     
    #190
    ched999uk likes this.
  11. eddie_squidd

    eddie_squidd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2011
    Messages:
    2,737
    Likes Received:
    2,369
    Yes Rosberg must be rather pissed off. I was going to say deflated but probably too soon.
     
    #191
  12. taeleon

    taeleon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2011
    Messages:
    492
    Likes Received:
    330
    Yeah. A bit of a let down by the team I guess.
     
    #192
    eddie_squidd likes this.
  13. BrightLampShade

    BrightLampShade Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Messages:
    13,495
    Likes Received:
    2,568
    #193
  14. dhel

    dhel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2011
    Messages:
    1,597
    Likes Received:
    224

    Especially if it is for safety reason and you still let a car run around at those speeds for 50 odd laps without saying anything and you knew before the start of the race then there is no real safety concerns then would it?
     
    #194
    Smithers likes this.
  15. BrightLampShade

    BrightLampShade Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Messages:
    13,495
    Likes Received:
    2,568
    please log in to view this image
     
    #195
    EternalMSC and Smithers like this.
  16. Smithers

    Smithers Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2011
    Messages:
    8,233
    Likes Received:
    811
    You have answered your own question there. If they are too hot and the pressure too high they will go off quicker but will likely be better in the initial laps. The teams want them in an operating window whilst racing and will likely compensate the initial slower laps at the beginning with lower pressures to ensure that they can keep them at a certain pressure when up to full race pace - which gets quicker the longer the stint/race. This is also where the driver can make a difference, full on fuel with low grip.

    Lewis described it very well in his interview (in simple terms) that you want a certain contact patch of the tyre to be used and this is normally achieved by lower pressures giving a wider contact patch. The higher the pressure the smaller the contact patch and the smaller the contact patch the more concentrated friction which increases temperature leading to thermal deg. He also confirmed that the lower the pressure the more performance you would gain. So if you set a tyre at 19.5 psi at a temp of 110 degrees but let that tyre cool to 90 degrees it would drop the pressure by X amount. This may extend the performance window over a competitor who kept their tyre temp/pressure at the set level.

    I obviously don't know the exact figures but the principle is correct - the team will calculate the highest possible temp/pressure that tyre can operate at. Then they will calculate (based on the long runs) how many laps at a certain pace, weight and driving style it will take to exceed that and lower the pressures accordingly for the number of laps the expect that driver to complete in that stint. In addition the driver may be requested to driver differently/slower to keep them in that operating window. Hopefully Cosi will put his technical input into this, but regardless of there being an advantage or disadvantage it's purely down to compliance or lack of.
     
    #196
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2015
    u408379965 likes this.
  17. eddie_squidd

    eddie_squidd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2011
    Messages:
    2,737
    Likes Received:
    2,369
    Seven races left is it? So Nico can now win every one but as long as Lewis finishes second he will win it by four points. It's no longer in Nico's hands.
     
    #197
    ched999uk likes this.
  18. EternalMSC

    EternalMSC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    10,624
    Likes Received:
    747
    Wouldn't even bother considering permutations, Rosbergs been put to sleep.
     
    #198
  19. BrightLampShade

    BrightLampShade Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Messages:
    13,495
    Likes Received:
    2,568
    #199
  20. eddie_squidd

    eddie_squidd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2011
    Messages:
    2,737
    Likes Received:
    2,369
    Rosberg says they turned it up for an attack on Vettel.
     
    #200

Share This Page