Match Day Thread PL: Liverpool v West Ham United

I actually feel for Lovren - because he will get the majority of the criticism whilst Skrtel (who was equally as poor) won't receive as much.

Both of them should be put down.

 

We spent £20m on Lovren to replace Sakho - let that sink in.

Markovic money could have been spent better but he;s a player who was bought for the future. Lallana was bought for the present and he's worse.

Markovic was a natural placement for Sterling - but everyone assumed Ibe was better than Sterling based on nothing.

 

Not true that. Like the rest of the post though.

 

Bit harsh I know - he has done more than I expected but still not enough, and missed a sitter against Arsenal. All in all, he's not been great but he's not been disastrous.

He was isolated yesterday which wasn't his fault. But this was always going to be the case because a player like him needs pacey runners playing ahead of him. Coutinho and Firmino like to play behind the striker.

 

Yep, nailed on all points there. Does anyone else fear that injury last spring for Ibe was actually a lot worse than they're letting on? He's lost a yard of pace, easily. Sterling replacement not.

 

not seen that said by any one.

i have said ibe deserves a chance in the first team, but i have seen him many times in the reserves so knew he was as good as sterling is but just needs the experience in the prem and game time.

Ibe will come good next season, same as sterling, he was up and down first season he started, problem with Ibe is i think we are a season behind with his progress, should have brought him through more when sterling was still here.

lallana i am still undecided on, i know what he can do, just whether we will ever see that from him.

 

It's strange - I've certainly noticed a drop in performance since that injury. Before then, he was brilliant.

He looked far better as a RWB than move advanced. Playing that deep gives him more space to run into.

 

It's not that he doesn't deserve criticism it's the joy that some people seem to be taking that our team plays badly. They sound borderline hysterical at times. Also have the tendency to throw around words like deluded and naive which makes them sound arrogant and dismissive towards other opinions.

I'll play a game. I'll put 3 posters names in a hat who I believe if this season goes badly and Rodgers gets replaced will spend an inordinate amount of time being self congratulatory rather than focus on the new manager.

Now on to your list. I'll go on the assumption you wrote it out because you believe the original names were better.

But.

Reina. Gone because he was a drama queen and not set the world alight since.

Carragher retired.

Gerrard basically retired.

Suarez as one of the top 4 players in the world forced his dream and always intended dream move to Spain.

So that's the decent spine gone that any manager would find hard to replace. Money or no.

As for the rest, the new players are clearly an improvement on the previous ones that have left overall. Some have gone on to perform well at other clubs but were never first picks if they stayed with us regardless of who the manager was. Some had come to their sell by date.

Do I think he's getting the best out of this squad? Not remotely. Can he? Don't know but I truly believe he's only got this year to prove he can. If he doesn't I believe FSG will think they've been more than fair with him and off he'll trot.

So we can sit and whine about every poor performance and decision like it's the end of the world and he's the anti christ. Point to signs in every average win at the terrible flaws and ignore the good performances because that might legitimise his tenure but personally I don't think that's good for the health.

 

I've seen a lot of fans (not necessarily on this board) that think Ibe can replace Sterling. He can;t because they are two different players. It's a lazy comparison because they're both young, fast and black. Sterling is better centrally and Ibe is more of a natural winger. Both talented and I think Ibe has potential to become better.

But Markovic is a more natural replacement for Sterling - and he got rid of him.

So now we have very little pace in the attack.

Lallana is a lost cause - get rid of him, Lovren, Lucas and Skrtel. 4 players who offer nothing but an obstacle for younger and more talented players.

 

I take no joy in losing but I take a lot of **** from a few on here for daring to see areas of weaknesses in our performances.

I refuse to have my head in the sand because we fluked a couple of 1-0 wins earlier on.

And for the record, when I present my argument, I initially don't insult people other than the actual players. But the responses I receive are insulting, dismissive, snidey, sarcy so I give it back. There are some people who have opinions which are the polar opposite to mine i.e. Saint or yourself but you won't sarcy or snidey in your responses.

 

Since it's been mentioned, does anyone here rate Lovren better than Wisdom? I'm not at all saying Wisdom is the answer (we need to stick with Sakho, and develop Illori imo) but what nob-headedness is behind the persistence with Lovren when we have far, far better players on the books? Gomez? Let's show clips of Lovren two years ago if we want to get rid of him, like showing 3-year-old photos of an old banger on E-bay. the more he plays, the less likely it is we'll ever get anything for him. Yes, he's that bad.

 

Lovren and Skrtel are a poison/cancer on the defence. Skrtel has Lovren or Johnson as scapegoats to hide behind but he was worse than Lovren yesterday - but Lovren made the big f*ck up which takes the attention.

Back to your point - neither are good enough for the club. There is NO reason to start Lovren ahead of Sakho. Literally none. I would develop Gomez or Ilori into the RCB role then continue to persist with that clown Skrtel.

When it comes to defending, there is such fine margins. Skrtel and Lovren made countless errors this season but because they weren't punished, fans don't notice them. Even when we conceded 2 legit goals against Bournemouth and Arsenal, fans still refused to see the issues.

 

personally no, we have spent a lot of money on a couple of players who are 20 mill plus and they are NOT an improvement on what we had on the books any way, money could have been better spent elsewhere.

i keep seeing brendans ego mentioned, i really really hope its not or he can **** right off down the job centre and get another job the ****, my ****ing club not his, he wont be a fan after he is sacked but this is my club until the day i die and have no **** treat it as a ****ing toy or an ego trip.

of course if its not then sorry brendan

 

It is ego. Rodgers never wanted Sakho. He wanted Williams but was overruled. Then he finished 2nd and was given more control and bought Lovren for no reason.

Now he's quick to drop players like Sakho, Moreno and send others out on loan. But gives countless chances to Lallana and Lovren.

Clear favouritism.

 

Oh you done laughing now like a manc are you and your tune is now you take no joy?

 

Maybe he just thinks Sakho is ****ing ****e and plays like Bambi on ice?

 

I better not be on your list!

I've said my piece already a long time since and have given Jimmy what for for playing just as big a favorite game as he accuses Rodgers of.

I just try to be realistic about it and didn't expect us to get top 4 this year no matter how much better we did as we've a lot of work to do... I've said as much in that we did just about everything possible with the money we had. 20 Mil + Ings fee net spend.

We got the full backs we got milner (Jimmy third far target and the captains band is the latest little dig) we got benteke who is far far better than anything we've had bar Suarez.

I've even talked about how in 5 years fsg have turn us around....

So I better not be on you list.

 

Maybe

 

LOOOOL - I may have missed it but I've not seen you criticise Skrtel for giving the ball away over the past 3/4 games, and have you criticised Lovren either?

You probably haven't - unsurprising really. The media have hardly noticed it either and as we all know, you pander to the media narrative rather than actually watch our play.

Bambi on Ice is a good one though - not sure who is more deluded? You or Rodgers

 

No dig at Milner - he for one actually gave a sh*t yesterday. Just wondering how he performed as captain when the chips were down. Could he be seen to motivate the troops when we fell behind?

But nothing has changed - he is a hard worker but what else has he done?

Surprised you haven;t slated Gomez for his errors? If he was Spanish and named Moreno, I'm sure you would have written him off by now?