Tam, the Mitchell brothers are a couple of hard heads from East Enders. Chippy quoted { I think Zarkander has the potential to be a champion hurdler but I stll think hurrican fly will win it next year if he's fit. The only way Binocular will win it is if all the other trainers pull their horses out in protest at Mr Henderson's long time friendship with the husband of Rebekah Brookes - it might even be him who was hacking people's phones........... } Rebekah Brookes is married to the actor who played Grant Mitchell in East Enders. Of course I never watched the show. My wife was a huge fan, so I got the story line, like it was local gossip. (Well that's my story and I'm sticking to it.)
Guys - just to clarify, Rebekah Brookes was married to one of the actors who played a Mitchell brother but is now married to charlie brookes who was a trainer and worked, and is good friends, with Mr Henderson. He currently wirtes for the Telegraph which is always something to miss and I am hoping that with the current furore the editor will see fit to boot him into touch. It's also interesting how the Sun and News of the World are always very protective of Mr Henderson - now you know why......
It’s perfectly possible that Binocular could have won the last 3 Champion Hurdles and he must certainly be considered unlucky to have just triumphed in one – ’09 was hardly the McCoy boy’s finest hour (he waited far too long until kicking for home) and, of course, ’11 saw those ‘unfortunate circumstances’ and the race was robbed of Binocular’s presence. I always think that the history books should be annotated with an asterisk re the 2011 contest to highlight Binocular’s absence and that there was, consequently, a default winner (albeit a decent one). If you agree with that or not surely no-one, and I do mean no-one, can question how imperious Mr Henderson’s champion was in the 2010 version as Binocular romped home in effortless style to become one of the easiest winners of the heat for several years – in fact I can still picture the scene now. Binocular swinging effortlessly into the home straight with the McCoy boy sat motionless, he then kicked him clear approaching the last went ‘one, two, three, ping’, over that flight, and then galloped up the hill faster than you can say ‘Cor blimey, what another fantastic training performance’. An effort that put Binocular into the ‘Hall of Fame’ of NH racing and ensured that his name would forever be uttered in the same breath as other top-class beasts. I don’t for one moment deny that Hurricane Fly is a very, very, very good horse, but people, I think at their respective best then Mr Henderson’s charge is the superior animal. Hopefully, they will get the change to clash this season when both are at their peak. Binocular is certainly in the very best of hands to regain his crown as his trainer, the forum’s favourite Mr Henderson, has, of course, 5 Champion Hurdle trophies on the old mantelpiece. However, re the 2012 version I’ll whisper this quietly...Spirit Son may be the one. Meanwhile, surely no-one is going to suggest that Hurricane Fly represents value for this race at a best priced 7/4. Are they??? Rebekah and that old rogue, Charlie Brooks, incidentally, live across the county line in Oxfordshire.
Barney, I can't agree with you on Binocular. For my money, the 2010 Champion Hurdle was a poor contest. Apart from Khyber Kim, the rest were 'strung out like washing' well before the last flight, and these horses eg. Khyber Kim, Zaynar, Celestial Halo, Solwhit, Medermit, etc, have shown up the mediocrity of the contest by their subsequent second-rate performances. In fact, since Istabraq retired, the overall quality, consistency, and level of top flight performance has been dire. Binocular himself has been an example of this inconsistency- winning only one 'decent race' (Xmas Hurdle) in his last five runs. Just look at Champion Hurdlers of the past- there's no need to name them- their consistency and reliability was almost always assured. This reliabilty has waned drastically in the last 8-10 years, likewise how "unsound" many of them are. In fairness to Hurricane Fly, he is an exception and, however you rate him, he is highly consistent. Looking forward to Cheltenham, the dearth of top hurdlers/prospects is there for all to see. You'd be a brave man to back against a repeat win for Hurricane Fly. Many will hope Zarkandar and Spirit Son can challenge, but second season hurdling is the kiss of death for most novices. Yes, Katchit did buck the trend and win a poor contest- and then went to the dogs- like most of them.
Although I rate HF higher than Binocular I would have to admit that they have yet to meet when both were on the top of their game - so in truth none of us know for sure which is the better horse. But I agree with Tam that HF is certainly the more reliable of the two and I also believe he is the classier. SBC - I think the redtop is retribution for Brooks for taking away Francome's gorgeous wife.
Have to love SBCs post, brilliant stuff! I think it's hard to argue that Binocular is a better horse than HF, yes Bino put up a fantastic performance when he won the CH, and the time was very good, but he's only ever put up a performance Like that once. I doubted HF but he has beaten everything that has been put infront of him pretty easily, and has had no off days, unlike Bino who is arguably the most inconsistent horse in training. Personally both at there best I'd side with HF because no horse has got to the bottom of him yet. Though I must say I'm of the opinion Bino's CH win was a better performance than HFs, but that's only comparing one race
Have to love SBCs post, brilliant stuff! I think it's hard to argue that Binocular is a better horse than HF, yes Bino put up a fantastic performance when he won the CH, and the time was very good, but he's only ever put up a performance Like that once. I doubted HF but he has beaten everything that has been put infront of him pretty easily, and has had no off days, unlike Bino who is arguably the most inconsistent horse in training. Personally both at there best I'd side with HF because no horse has got to the bottom of him yet. Though I must say I'm of the opinion Bino's CH win was a better performance than HFs, but that's only comparing one race
I agree Shergy, clinking response but the above line gave me the biggest chuckle of the lot, as they say! It's some talent to write such good stuff with glasses THAT strongly tinted still on
Beef, I really can not understand why you are seemingly of the belief that Hurricane Fly is the second coming of Pegasus and Binocular some selling plater?!? I prefer to think of them both as very, very good horses and would not opt to belittle either. I’m of the opinion that if they ever did clash, at their respective peaks, then Mr Henderson’s charge would win. But I would add not by far. I think you are being most unfair on Binocular to suggest there is a huge chasm between the relative merits of him and Hurricane Fly. The official handicapper would certainly not agree with you as their best ever marks are very closely aligned (Hurricane Fly 173, Binocular 171). Also, Binocular is currently rated, on official marks, the 3rd best 2 mile hurdler in training and this could be in effect be the 2nd best if Peddler’s Cross deserts the hurdling ranks for a career over the big ‘uns. If you think Hurricane Fly is the better of the pair then that’s fair enough but please don’t try to demean Binocular’s achievements.
Absolutely SBC. Binocular's best form puts him very close to HF. I also think HF is the superior animal but you are right to chastise for talking down Binocular. Henderson's horse does seem to hard to get racing fit - before he won the Champion they had to send him to Ireland for a new regime and that worked. But when he is right he is very good indeed.
I'm not convinced Bino is the 3rd best hurdler, I'd say Thousand Stars and Oscar Whisky are his superior aswell as HF and PC, and who could argue Solwhit isn't better than Bino, afterall he beat Thousand Stars a few times finishing behind HF. Then we have the novices stepping up to the big time, so Bino could be pretty far down the pecking order next season
Officially, the current marks, at the moment, are: 173 Hurricane Fly 170 Peddlers Cross 165 Binocular 162 Menorah, Solwit 160 Celestial Halo, Clerks Choice, Overturn Both Oscar Whiskey and Thousand Stars also have marks of 165 but these career highs were earned at distances in excess of 20 furlongs. The only other hurdlers with marks in excess of 160, at any distance, are the stayers Grand Crus (167) and Big Buck’s (174). Interestingly, and a huge pointer to the future Mr Henderson trained 5 out of the top 10 rated novice hurdlers last season based on official marks (Spirit Son, Bobs Worth, Grandouet, Sprinter Sacre and Mossley). He may seriously, seriously push Mr Nicholls for the ’trainers championship’ this term. I’m sure the celebrations on the forum would be both joyful and immense if that happened…
Barney I am very very firmly of the belief that Hurricane Fly is very special and from everything he has shown on the course has vindicated this belief. I believe he will win multiple Champion Hurdles (injury excepting) and could fill the void left by the great Istrabraq and establish himself at the very pinnacle of the sport. I would not, or ever, suggest Binocular as being off the same standard as a selling plater, just in the same way I wouldn't make this comparison of the other recent Champion Hurdlers Katchit, Punjabi and Sublimity
Beef - if HF was a five year old I'd agree that he has multiple CH winner written all over him. But his age and tendency to pick up injuries are both against him winning more than a couple. And let's not forget that the CH is almost always a very hard race to win. The CH division was very exciting last season and next season promises more of the same with the young horses coming through.
So let's clarify Fulkes, were going for Spirit Son and that Genius Mr Henderson to knock HF off his perch. Let's hope so anyways
Not sure about that Shergar. I'm just saying that HF is far from a shoo-in (to nick your catch-phrase). I'm a big fan of HF and backed him in the Champion but everything is beatable. The CH is too tough a race to say any horse is sure to be a multiple-winner, especially one which is already seven and injury-prone
Shergy I'm not an expert on ratings but I'm sure Spirit Son would have a fair bit to find with Hurricane before they've even the right to think he'd give the Champion a race never mind have the ability to knock him 'off his perch'? Not sure, you might know, but I'd guess at least a stone to find? I'd agree with you though that he's still more of a 'threat' than Binocular who was knocked well and truly 'off his perch' at Punchestowns
I suggest you actually look at the times of the Supreme and the Champion Hurdle, before you start claiming Spirit Son has a stone to find. The Supreme was a very hot renewal, and I believe that will be proved next season
Shergy times are largely irrelevant in National Hunt, the pace is set by the front-runner and a quick time isn't possible behind a slow gallop! Overturn set a stop, start gallop in the Champion so a quick time was never possible! It's not rocket science my friend!
Granted the time argument isnt concrete evidence of anything, but to completely dismiss it is a little naive. Comparing times on different days isn't very accurate as the ground plays apart, but when both times were set on the same day I feel it is a fair comparison. The times also prove that Al Ferof and Spirit Son would both have been capable of challenging in the Champion Hurdle. Spirit Son was only 5 then, so give him another year and he could certainly win a Champion Hurdle. We all know what Mr Henderson is like at preparing a horse for the CH, he gets them in the condition of there life's everytime, like with Punjabi and Binocular in recent years
