What is it that people don't get that benefits fraud pales into comparison with corporate industry fraud. People are being brainwashed into thinking that benefits fraud is where our main problem resides. Lets not forget those fcking bankers that took 100s of billions of pounds for fcking things up. Its a fcking joke. But lets all blame the benefits scroungers. We live in strange times.
Check out how Irish journalist Vincent Browne grills Klaus Masuch from the ECB on why Ireland has to pay billions of Euros for a defunct Euro bank.
Some people are idiots, some are sheep! But it's always easier to blame 'him down the road whose getting stuff I'm not, and he's not entitled to' - especially if all the press (especially the one's like News Corp owned ones, with some pretty dodgy tax practices, or the Daily Mail/Channel 5/Metro who are based off shore to avoid paying tax) are pumping this propaganda out that there's millions of work-shy, lazy benefits scroungers living the life of riley on our dollar. It's easier to blame them than some faceless corporation or nameless banker/millionaire who is defrauding the country of millions, while the press says nothing about it. I mean the fact that there's no jobs for people on benefits to go to, because of the stagnating economy (with the worst recovery in history), filled with zero hour jobs which are so far below the living wage it's unreal, is ignored, as is the other fact of how many people are driven to suicide by the draconian benefits cuts and sanctions, is also ignored. But it's the same story throughout history - while the rich and powerful get even richer and more powerful, there will always be some vulnerable group to be highlighted as scapegoats for the rest of the poor and weak to direct their ire onto.
I acknowledge it isn't anywhere near as big an issue, but it is an issue nevertheless. The £m lost in benefit fraud (inc housing) could also be put to very good use helping those in legitimate need. It's a sad fact of life that certain types of crime (tax fraud, insurance fraud etc) are rarely high on the public's list of priorities. Many of us are also too quick to include 'loopholes' when talking about tax fraud, even though they are not illegal and have been left in place by governments of all political persuasions. So, to clarify again; I am in favour of a benefits system as long as it only gets spent on those in genuine need. Much stricter means testing is needed, as proven by the high amount of benefit fraud taking place. I am in favour of immigration as long as it is for those in genuine need. I think we should be taking in more souls fleeing war and persecution, even if on a temporary basis (until said conflicts are resolved). I am opposed to others taking my money because they think they know how to spend it better than I do. I am in favour of being able to opt out of the National Insurance system. I want the option to go private if I so wish. I am opposed to the 'Nanny State' mentality and very much in favour of a lot more individual responsibility. I strongly believe our nanny state encourages & perpetuates a sense of entitlement and lack of responsibility for self in too many people. A great number of whom need to stop suckling from my tits and go try to find a way to feed themselves!
This is 99% bs. Once again you are saying that anyone who votes Tory or earns a decent wage are idiots who cannot think for themselves. Anyone who earns above average should be stripped of a chunk of their money in order to feed others who don't earn as much. The only jobs available to the unemployed are zero hours contracts. The plight of those in genuine need is ignored by anyone other than the left wing. Do you not realise how really stupid this makes you look?
Sorry where did I say any of that??? I think this will be my last response to you though I'm sorry, as if your not a wum then you seem to severely misread what people say and respond quite aggressively to what they haven't said, but you think they have said. As such, continuing to argue/explain with you is just going to escalate things, which I can't really be bothered to do. You made a very good, rational post in your previous post, but that's the only one I've seen you make on this thread. Unfortunately, though you may be unaware of this, the rest of your posts come across as baiting or needlessly aggressive. Hope you have better chats on other threads with you though.
Here goes... Some people are idiots, some are sheep! But it's always easier to blame 'him down the road whose getting stuff I'm not, and he's not entitled to' - especially if all the press (especially the one's like News Corp owned ones, with some pretty dodgy tax practices, or the Daily Mail/Channel 5/Metro who are based off shore to avoid paying tax) are pumping this propaganda out that there's millions of work-shy, lazy benefits scroungers living the life of riley on our dollar. It's easier to blame them than some faceless corporation or nameless banker/millionaire who is defrauding the country of millions, while the press says nothing about it. = Right wing voters blindly follow certain propaganda. Ergo, are unable to form their own opinions. "Not sure how asking for a little bit more money from people buying 'mansions' won't raise more money?" = Anyone who earns above average should be stripped of a chunk of their money in order to feed others who don't earn as much. (there are other examples of your stating that the rich should not get tax cuts which amounts to the same thing) "I mean the fact that there's no jobs for people on benefits to go to, because of the stagnating economy (with the worst recovery in history), filled with zero hour jobs which are so far below the living wage it's unreal..." = The only jobs available to the unemployed are zero hours contracts. As for my 4th point. Your whole mantra is based upon the Tories being racist, corrupt, selfish etc etc... I am a Tory voter and do not match the picture both yourself & Brunelgooner like to paint of me and will always respond to your comments accordingly. Quite simply, If you do not like the taste of your own medicine, don't dish it out in the first place.
A lot of this modern libertarian crap just seems shortsighted and naive, to me. It seems to be an attempt to live within society while completely divorcing oneself from it, while trying to avoid any negative repercussions. Totally unrealistic. As for the Tories not being racist, corrupt and selfish, I thought that was their slogan?
I missed the bit where someone said corporate industry fraud isn't greater than or more serious than benefit fraud. I would love to see a link to it if such a thing exists.
The DWP claim that £1.2bn was lost to benefit fraud in the 2013/14 fiscal year. Errors accounted for another £3bn, startlingly. The HMRC lost £34bn that year in tax that is should have been paid but wasn't. http://www.theweek.co.uk/62461/which-costs-more-benefit-fraud-or-tax-avoidance
Some people on this thread are making out that thinking benefit fraud is a problem that should be dealt with, somehow means that person doesn't think tax dodging should be clamped down on. It's perfectly possible for someone to notice both problems and want both dealt with To lots of people, saying "oh but there's other problems too" doesn't make the original problem being discussed any less of a problem or change there stance on that unrelated problem.
I think it's more that some people are saying that the poor are being demonised and victimised to pay for the mistakes of everyone - but particularly the bankers, hedge fund owners and the government. Then anyone who happens to be poor or vulnerable is being slandered in the press and by Tory ministers as being 'scroungers' despite any facts. Of course there are scroungers, there always has been and always will be, it is important to reduce the number of scroungers, but should be do that at the expense of driving desperate people to suicide or the most vulnerable in society onto the street or into food banks to be able to eat. It seems a rather cruel society that would do that to people, while at the same time increasingly letting the rich get off scot free, and giving companies increasing amounts of power and profit over all aspects of our life, from healthcare, to education, to policing and prisons, to even decisions on whether someone is fit to work or not, or the level of their health.
http://gu.com/p/4bpzz?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other Some of what I was talking about, work shy scroungers don't tend to die when you deny them their benefits unlike disabled people who depend on their disability allowances just to live...
Selective eyesight means this snippet from the above link was ignored. "The DWP defended the accuracy of the WCA and said the statistics proved no causal effect between benefits and mortality. It said: “These isolated figures provide limited scope for analysis, and nothing can be gained from this publication that would allow the reader to form any judgment as to the effects or impacts of the WCA.” but don't let the truth get in the way of yet more loony left propaganda
I usually try not to respond, but sorry I have to ask a question. Why so insulting and demeaning? Also I didn't ignore that bit, but seeing the department that has dismissed these figures is also the department that has been fighting not to release these or any other figures, and is already accountable for at least 50 deaths (and has admitted it), has also caused untold misery to thousands of people, while is run by a lying, amoral politician in IDS, it makes their trustworthiness a little shaky. I'm not saying that every single one of those deaths is because they lost their benefits, but the mere fact that people who are about to die/on deaths door get passed fit to work is worth questioning and looking into isn't it. As is the policy to withhold money, and reduce the standards of living and care afforded to people on deaths door. But as throughout this thread, I imagine you'll ignore most of what I and others say, assume we're saying other things (and take offence at that), use some insulting and dismissive phrases and attack both me and the vulnerable people who find themselves in this desperate situation...
Why do you always believe everything that the government says? Do you honestly take everything at face value without looking into matters properly? Does it not occur to you that in this situation they are going to do whatever they can to absolve themselves of responsibility & culpability because it would reflect horrifically on them if they did admit to it?
Every single statistic and figure the government quotes to try and gloss over any of the issues that we, as a society, have to deal with can easily be debunked through a bit of research. The government says they have created x amount of jobs, how many of them are in temporary employment with rubbish wages and include workfare? How many of these jobs in the figure they mention are actually through self-employment (which the government deserves no credit for at all)? The government cut our public services, cut jobs and wages in real terms, cut people's disability benefits, sell off parts of the NHS to private providers, fail to reach their housing targets yet they tell people that immigration and 'benefit scroungers' are the problem whilst MPs increase their own salaries and use tax havens to avoid paying their share because they are motivated by greed and exploitation? I just find it unbelievable that the government are essentially trying to get people to fight and blame one another for the problems the government themselves have caused and people keep falling into their trap.
