Your right Boss man I was thinking like that. The point I'm making is we are not going to get a top drawer manager in. We have not earnt that pleasure. We have to get people in that have shown potential, may do this, could do that. So I think it is important to support whoever we get initially and then lay into him after a few seasons not straight away
As I've made clear on other threads, I'm of the opinion that A) MP should be given at least 3 seasons unless things go disastrously wrong. B) The majority of a manager's success boils down to being in the right place at the right time and finding an era that suits them at a club that suits them. There are very few truly incompetent managers out there, as well as very few true managerial geniuses. There are countless examples of this in both directions: Pardew, Monk and Koeman were all appointed to a general raising of eyebrows, but all have been immensly successful due to settling at clubs that match their own philosophies. By contrast, managers hailed as pretty decent such as Redknapp and Moyes have had absolute mares at certain clubs because those clubs were joined at completely the wrong time and had completely the wrong set up. The rebuilding jobs at QPR and United respectively were beyond the considerable abilities of those managers from day 1 and I know it's easy to say 'I told you so' but I for one put money on QPR getting relegated the day they appointed Harry to rescue the sinking ship and got £95 for my efforts. I've said previously that a great deal of Harry's success here was that he inherited a squad that matched his philosophy and skill set down to the T. That's not to take away from his achievements here whatsoever and I DON'T mean it as a dig, only to say that whoever advised levy to move for him and whoever advised Harry to accept the offer both made very astute decisions. The same goes for BMJ who was a massive success here with a squad that could comfortably deliver the solid 442 formation with 2 complementing strikers and versatile full backs that he prefers. Again whoever appointed him had a stroke of genius, whereas whoever thought Ramos was a good idea was blind, stupid or simply whimsical. By contrast, BMJ had an absolute mare at West Brom with a more workman like and defensive squad that lacked the flair of a spurs side. So, in discussing replacing MP we have two options: either a manager who will be able to literally pick up from where he left off and take that unit up to another level (which is literally what Harry did from day 1). Or to bring in a manager whose philosophy and approach are clearly completely different to the current set up, who will consequently need enormous funds and make widespread changes so that the squad fits his philosophy, and that eventually this will lead to improvements. The latter was the (idiotic) thinking behind appointing AVB, whilst it was clearly hopes that MP would largely be able to pick up from where AVB left off and use a similar system and players to take us up to another level. The problem is that the recruitment policy under AVB and Baldini was SO flawed that we wasted millions on players who weren't suited to his system from day one, amongst others who had attitude problems, and others who were simply objectively cack. This meant that we brought in a new manager who prefers a similar set up, formation and philosophy to AVB (albeit with a bit more flair), who STILL needed a complete overhaul to settle on a squa d to achieve this. Only at Tottenham
I'm going to sit on the fence for a while. I'm tempted to say, Yes, as he seems to be a one trick pony who has no answers when that trick doesn't work. But, I'll reserve judgement for a few more weeks.
I voted "will succeed if..." under protest. The correct answer is almost certainly yes, because almost all managers fail eventually. The question is whether Pochettino achieves temporary success. I think he will. The point which stands out, to me, is that you can slate Pochettino all you want, but if you say he should be sacked you’re giving a vote of confidence to our ability to select coaches--which your slating of Pochettino indicates is unwise. Surely if we’re going to do nothing but hire crap coaches, there’s no reason to do it often. Twisting hasn’t worked for long enough it’s time to see how sticking goes.
Agree with this Hiag - Poch will take you as far as 5th in PL but not into top 4, and he will keep doing this but won't be given the time to push on as Levy will sack him and then you start again with new manager changing squad and being 6th or 7th on PL. levy should back him and be happy for 5th every year till new stadium built and increased revenues mean you can push on. Imo I think Levy will pull the trigger at the wrong time as you need stability not complete overhaul
It's not often that I agree 100% with an Arsenal fan but that's an analysis that most sane Spurs fans share: right now we're deluded to think that top 4 is a realistic target. There might be the odd blip here and there but to achieve it with the consistency of yourselves is simply beyond our reach until we strengthen financially. However, it does look like Poch is being given at least 3 years. I'd point to the mass clear-out of deadwood this window - almost all at cut-down (forgive the pun) prices, to clear space for him to craft a squad of his choice. We've found shifting deadwood notoriously difficult in the past, largely due to Levy's penny-pinching. That doesn't seem to be an obstacle anymore. For the next 3-4 years, our top priority has to be remaining within touching distance of the top 4, building steadily on a solid platform of young academy products who are less likely to leave the minute a bigger clubs flashes a chequebook, and then push on in earnest once the stadium is up and running. So far, so good on both of these fronts but you never know, our 'solution' for back up to Kane might turn out to be Emile Heskey on a 4 year contract knowing us
If Poch can keep you in top 6 and not fall too far behind he will have done well. you need to pay for stadium whilst being competitive all the while knowing all the other teams are using their Sky money to add and improve their teams. in time you guys will realise what a truly ****ing amazing achievement it was of Wenger to keep us in top 4 and in CL for nearly 20 years whilst working with money constraints in paying off new stadium and losing best players as we couldn't afford to match other clubs wages.
I've always realised what a job Wenger has done at Arsenal tbh. I've never understood any of the "Wenger out" stuff that a minority of Arsenal fans start up every so often. Top 4, well run, minimal debt, quality football. You gotta know when you have it good.
Out of interest, what do people want from Poch, what do they expect of him? I don't see how he's doing anything but a good job with the players he has, he took over a team of duds and ended up finishing 5th with the youngest squad in the league, he's now strengthened the weakest area from last season while also likely adding more players before the window shuts. The work done by AVB/ Baldini etc really ****ed us up and Poch has had to pay for it while also being tasked to rebuild us, Levy gave him a 5 year deal and he's only just completed the first of those. We've gone through a number of transitions in the past but what Poch had to deal with was on another level and finishing 5th suggests to me he passed with flying colours. We all want to see glamorous football coupled with a trophy and I think slowly but surely that may/ will come, we're getting the right players now and we've got young players improving game by game. I don't think any manager we'd hire could instantly guarantee us success or even do a better job than Poch (if at all), especially while the top 4 constantly add £30m-£40m players all the time which further separates them from the chasing pack.
I think part of he problem is nothing seems to change, or improve. I mean the way we just disintegrated against mighty Stoke! So, so typical Spurs - it's been going on forever, it seems. I think it just fuels overall dissatisfaction, you just feel like it's the same old, same old, without any progress
The Stoke downfall wasn't really his fault, we were superb for 70 minutes and then Kane had to go off injured which didn't help and he took Mason off as he still isn't match fit, he was forced to make those choices. Toby then gave away a sloppy penalty and Ireland/ Diouf scored a freak goal. That was **** luck rather than poor management. Just like Utd, Bentaleb gives a sloppy pass, Walker does well getting back but his tackle results in the ball going past Vorm.
True enough SoS, but in both games we were well on top and in control, then inexplicably allowed the opposition back in. Against Stoke, we'd already started doing this as early as the period in between our two goals. They had that one great chance near half time where Jan and Toby were caught watching a high ball and Diouf somehow sneaked his 6'4" frame in between them only to head straight at Hugo from 2 yards out. That should've been a goal and would've changed the game completely. At this level, you simply cannot ride your luck against most PL teams without getting found out. We need to learn to be more ruthless and just finish teams off while they're still under our thumb.
I don't expect top 4 and it's not realistic at the moment but I don't see any improvement from AvB or Sherwood. Squad is still unbalanced and average with only maybe 2-3 stand out players.
Yeah granted mate but In each game the opposition is going to have at least 1 or 2 chances to score, that's just down to a law of averages in a 90 minute match which is where the keeper then earns his money. Toby and Jan have looked pretty solid in their two games but ultimately the opposition will break through at some point, very rarely will a defence completely keep out the opposition, giving your keeper a free pass for day. Even when Chelsea play 11 men at the back there's still a moment where the opposition will at least get one sight of goal. What we need to work on is ensuring that the chances that opposition get are not through mistakes but are from general good play that is just hard to defend against. All goals conceded so far have been through mistakes or **** luck. Bentaleb gave the ball away for Utd's goal. Toby gave away a needless penalty. Diouf/ Ireland scored a freak goal. Prior to Toby giving away the penalty I really didn't see anything other than a Spurs win. Mistakes like that is what we need to learn from but that's something that can't be coached, Toby knew he ****ed up straight away and so I'm hoping that if he finds himself in a similar situation down the line he'll know how not to react.
