Greece votes No: The European Union is dying before our eyes- Nigel Farage please log in to view this image
The evidince to my mind points towards intransigence and inability to make a decision. The eu doesn't know hwo decides.. ministers, ecb, merkel and rolande... etc etc. nobody can actually make a decision and it suits all the creditors for no decision. 3 years we've know n the greeks would never pay.. 5 years really... still no decision and the debts racked up. The only workable solution now is debt write off but nobody will do that this week.
I think Scotland are going to think twice now about breaking away from the rest of UK, after Greece result.
??? thats 2+2 = 560 that makes zero sense as the pound and scotland has zero to do with greece borrowing shedloads and failing to pay it back.
The EU, essentially the IMF and ECB said they won't negotiate with him anf froze him out. This is how democracy dies. It's dead. He won't be back imo. Everything I've said about the EU is being proven to be true in this whole mess. The EU is undemocratic, completely
I think it suits the greeks nicely and the PM there can say oh look he's gone lets have a deal lads. when the deal is done the guy will probably resurface. I agree the eu is undemocratic but worse its totally inept and incompetant and everyone looks at everyone else and nobody makes a decision. If it really were the gremans took over and the 4th reich at least some ****er would tell everyone what to do. total basket case. Was fine when it was a common market. this grand dream crap is just nuts. When the russians roll over estonia next the eu won't do a thing. neither will nato of course. they are all weak.
The dream of having a political union is just a dream. There are too many obstacles to surmount : different peoples, different economies, different languages, different paces. And to have a single currency for all nations and include a strong economy like Germany and a weak one like Greece cannot work without political union. The experiment was bound to fail. 24 hours after a democratic decision, what has changed? Has it made the creditors more flexible about reforms? No. In fact the Germans, French and Dutch have become more strident in their call for reform. As I said the referendum was a total waste of time. All it did was to antagonise the creditors and make it more likely that Greece will drop out of the Eurozone. The Germans were not bluffing when they said that a No vote would mean that the Greek people voted against staying in. Tsipras and specially varoufakis ((who called the creditors Terrorists!!) took totally the wrong position. If you are negotiating with people you owe a massive amount of money you've got to realise you've got to offer something in return. To come across as aggressive, insulting the other party, and thinking you've got the upper hand, was the wrong strategy. I thought that months . I wasn't surprised when varoufakis was forced to go.
It was on the BBC there a week ago, where one of the ECB were meeting with yer man who reisgned, the EU guy was ****ing livid The guy would not budge and was obviously trying to stop what the ECB and IMF were doing. After 5 years bending over, things are worse than ever and getting deeper into the pockets of the IMF and ECB just meant 5 more years Greece would be worse off than today No doubt any assistance to Greece dependent on them freezing out the Greek finance minister because he had balls. Freezing out the Finance minister for Greece given we are talking money and bailouts and the economy, left him no choice but to resign, it was his job to negotiate after all. His position was untenable
Wall Street Obama now chimes in on the Greece issue. This has nothing to do with sewing Europe up with TTIP by the way, once the member states are hammered with austerity, then the corps can harvest Europe with privatisaion and deregulation after the banks have done their bailout austerity harvesting and trimming the fat from state owned enterprises and services. A weaker EU suits America. A strong EU and EU currency is a threat to America's national security (their own words) ffs. Austerity is really preparation for firesales (in smaller economies) and privatisation Europe wide. No one wants Greece to quit. That's a certainty. Obama getting involved is a clear indicator of the corporations and banks running the show. Given the IMF was flying greek journalists to the US and "training them" on improving the Troika's image in greece, it's easy to see who the interested parties are. Corps, hedge funds and banks. Obama Tries to Soften European Creditors’ Stance to Salvage a Deal http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/01/w...-creditors-stance-to-salvage-a-deal.html?_r=0
Game of poker nearing its climax: we are near the showing of the hands. The deadline for the Greeks to accept reforms which are tougher than the ones they rejected in the referendum is Sunday. Accept and they stay in the Euro. Reject and they are out. The so called show of democracy counted for nothing. The Greek people were led up the garden path by a bunch of young game theory players. Whatever happened to Tsipras poppycock assertion that a No vote would reinforce the Greeks hand in the negotiations? I never believed that and when varoufakis called the creditors ( I.e the Germans ) a bunch of terrorists, the game was up. The Germans and the other creditors could NOT let the Greeks have better terms. It would lead to the unravelling of the whole euro project and lack of fiscal discipline across the Eurozone.
I think we are waiting for the dealer to turn the river card. I thik the greeks don't even matter. its the next wave that they don't want to fix. spain and italy.
Difficult to see a country going bankrupt, because power would like to keep power out. Capitalist would like to keep communist out. Greece leaving European Union opens door for Russia, which the European Union are scared off.
Sure. I think the greek government has been banking on this all along. For 5 months they've just strung the creditors along and refused to give even the smallest concession. They have always looked at the bottom line: No matter what Greece did the Eurozone will never cut them loose. For political reasons. One to keep the Euro together but also to keep the Russians at arms length. It looks now that whatever the outcome one side will lose face. The referendum has seen to that. What the greek PM and his (previous) finance minister seemed to have omitted from their tactical manoeuverings is that for Greece to win, the Germans and many others have to lose and worse now have to lose face. If I were a betting man, I wouldn't bet on Merkel and her finance minister having to go away with their tails between their legs...:
I agree. this is only greece after all 280bil or something? euro area can print it and ecb can buy all their debt tomorrow. Its the spain and italy problems that are the issue. greece will be busted.
And if the greeks do get out of the Euro, it will entirely the fault of their pM guided by varoufakis. But ultimately that may not be such a bad thing. They will have their destiny in their own hands.
