Off Topic Political Debate

I only say leave the EU debate for now - today is about the election that has been held not a referendum to come - do you see yourself as a soothsayer?
I think people would have trusted Blair (goodness knows why when you think of Iraq - but they did).
Scotland was non Tory - they were opposition MPs whether they wore the Red of Labour or the Yellow of SNP so it made no difference to the Tory majority. The election was won in England and Wales - the Tories actually took 3 extra seats in Wales - two from Labour - almost unheard of. In addition very few parties have increased their number of seats in a second term - Cameron's record on this will stand with the best. He has taken the Tories from no overall majority in 2010 to an outright win in 2015. Like him or detest him (as you clearly do) makes no difference -you have to concede he has achieved a good result for his party.
Oh - and many Scots I know would dispute your claim that the SNP are traditionally left of Labour - many say their appeal is that they combine good aspects from the left and the right (Bolton may be able to throw some light on that)

 

Aren't we all glad though that we can distract ourselves with the idiocy of politics today rather than worrying about a Play Off match tomorrow

 

Leo, he has achieved a good result. The Lion's share of the gained seats however came from their previous coalition partners Con + 22 seats, Lib Dems -47. You appear to believe that Labour's 'problem' was that it was too far to the left but the facts don't bear that out - the SNP gained 50 seats (Nearly all from Labour) and Labour lost 26 seats - which means that if you disregard the SNP and Scotland then Labour actually gained 24 seats. The reason for the Conservatives win was that they successfully clobbered their coalition partners over the head - which tells us little about Labour.

 

If the SNP were to hold a referendum without "assistance" by the UK as last year - they are after all talking about breaking up the UK - then they would need to make that a policy in their next Scottish election manifesto. They could not simply take power with 51% of the vote and then declare they have a mandate.
If they broke their promise that the referendum was a once in a lifetime event then it would also be legitimate for the rest of the UK to demand a say in whether or not they acted upon a "unilateral declaration of independence" There is a precedent for that.
The Scots may not like it - but equally the rest of the UK may not like the Scots conning them.

 

Thankfully polls were not accurate and we have a working majority without coalition. Real down side is SNP performance in Scotland, not going to be easy to manage....

 

Oh please - you are a psephologist now are you? Votes went all over the place with gains and losses to and from lots of areas. Again you just make a bland assertion with no back up. One thing we do know is that when the LibDems formed a coalition with the Conservatives a substantial number of people who voted for them were very angry and vowed never to vote LibDem again. Equally those who despised Clegg for his tuition fee about turn (left wing not of course Tory) did not turn to the Tories. The Tories gained seats where Lib Dems vote collapsed and those people turned to an unelectable Labour candidate. Hardly the fault of a Tory if his opposition commit hari kiri is it?
Overall over 6% more of the population voted Tory than Labour and they won the election
.Have the good grace that Miliband, Clegg and Farage have had. Accept the result as the will of the British people and move on.

 

Leo, you do not need to be a psephologist to know that the SNPs seats nearly all came from Labour and that Labour in fact gained in the rest of the UK (though not enough) - that is simple maths. Therefore the assertion that Labour lost because it was too far to the left has no real evidence. Obviously every party was taking from every other party (we don't know how many Ukip actually took from Labour for example) but there are trends which you can see. You say 'accept the will of the British people`well I'm afraid I can't because 36-37% does not translate into a majority however you try to dress it up. Does it feel democratic to know that the only other countries in Europe with single party majorities are Russia and Belarus ?

 

Of course - I never said otherwise, nor have they. That's why Cameron is going to have to tread carefully over the next ten months - he's not going to get away with his 'lovebomb followed by sneering contempt' tactics again, the one that either knowingly or inadvertently just destroyed Scottish Labour, and one I'm sure I caught a glimpse of this morning from him when speaking about his erstwhile coalition partners.

Anything and everything he does over that period which adversely affects Scots and their aspirations will be dissected, digested and pushed to the fore, in order to ensure the percentage share of the vote is achieved.

 

In Scotland Labour voters switched to SNP - simples - and made zero difference. One bunch of anti-Tories or another.Irrelevant to everything outside Scotland

In the rest of the UK the LibDem vote collapsed - we know many are left wing (they continually said so over the last 5 years) - good assumption they went to Labour mostly. UKIP took lots of votes - seems more from Tories but surprisingly so from Labour too. Tory vote increased and so the way first past the post works they benefitted more than Labour from a split opposition. BUT WHO CARES? The Tories won the election by getting the most votes - who those people voted for 5 years ago is again irrelevant.

37% is not a majority. But over 325 seats out of 650 IS - that is what counts. First past the post has been our electoral system for ever. If you think it should be changed then work for it. By the way PR was debated and lost in the last Parliament. Just because you don't like or approve of our electoral system does not make it non Democratic. I can give you as good an argument to say that with an overall majority or not it is fair that the party with most votes and seats sets the agenda and tries to govern on policies that received MORE VOTES than any other. A PR system means that some silly party that happens to hold one seat could have the deciding say on policy - and you call that better democracy? Do you really? I do not give a hoot what other forms of Democracy exist - ours is good and works and we have generally stable governments unlike many of those in the likes of Belgium and Italy that you parade as real democracies. At least we now know what the policies of the largest party and the one that forms the government are - no need for a German style horse trading of "you drop this policy and we will drop that". The British people showed how much they liked that on tuition fees.
Perhaps it is better you live in Germany as you prefer their style of democracy to ours. I am happy with what has served the UK for centuries

 

Agree with that. I too hated his sneering and gloating over destroying the LibDems in the West Country. He should remember that without the LibDems over the last 5 years he would not be PM now. I still do not like him. Smug and arrogant

 

What an excellent night of political drama, it completely restored my confidence in the electorate. The British people finally realised the tremendous job the Tory dominated coalition had done to repair the enormous damage inflicted by labour.
I now look forward to a strong Conservative government who can carry out its mandate without petty interference from another party.
The first past the post system will not change. In addition one of the first tasks is to correct the unfair electoral boundaries which should give the Tories another 20 seats at the next election.

It also confirmed that UKip and the Greens are merely protest votes and will have no effect whatsoever in the next 5 years.

Who said the two party system is dead?

 

I loved Paul Weller's reaction on being told David Cameron said he used to listen to the Jam at Eton "he obviously wasn't listening to the effing words was he?"

There were some extraordinary results in terms of majorities. One Minister I used to work for had a majority of 66 in 2010 - he was returned with over 7000.

 

UKIP got 3 million votes - I wouldn't write them off. Mind you, this is one inconsistency thrown up by the current system that I won't complain about.....

 

Incidentally, comfort can be taken in some of the votes polled for "other" parties. The Monster Raving Loonies got twice the number of votes as the BNP!

 

Saw this result coming for months .
Tory lies often repeated , the vile Sun Newspaper / Murdock Empire , good old fashioned divide and rule tactics ( Tory boy Farage's Ukippers ) , plus a weak unelectable leader, have all contributed to Labours downfall.
The result will be the vast majority of Britain's population will be significantly worse off and the wealthy 5 % will be laughing all the way to the bank .
This is democracy ...Sadly, a poorly educated , easily fooled , largely ignorant population has allowed these self serving parasites in yet again .... as a nation we have only ourselves to blame .
Mind you the Tories have a really tough time ahead ... The deficit , the rise of ISIS and Russia's sabre rattling are all serious concerns . This victory could quickly become a poison challis .
Labour need to regroup and move to the left .
Glad to see Milliband has gone . Now need a combative man's man ..or a female like Nicola Sturgeon to move the party forward.
My prediction next time around ...a Labour landslide .

 

And yet UKIP had far more votes than the SNP

 

That is the main point I think. It wasn't that people wanted Tory, they just didn't want the disaster that Miliband would bring while he sold us out to the Scottish Nazi party and the Stalinist Unions

 

The voting system in this country is archaic.. .needs to change... and we need to move away from this divisive politics.

Mind you the LIb(Dems) have been saying it for years

I am very disappointed in the result.... personally I shall probably be better off in my pocket ironically... but I really worry about our welfare state, our roads, our libraries, etc etc....

 

Ironically the real losers are the Scottish people. They are being conned by the SNP, just like Hollande did in France, that there is any alternative to austerity. The election results will hasten the next independence vote.

In a few years Scotland could have the financial umbilical cord from London cut, mass exodus of capital and business going south and a currency that nobody wants. In addition the EU have warned them not to rely on the country being allowed to stay in the EU.

I would be worried if I lived in Scotland at the moment.

 

Welcome to the forum but could you please refrain from calling the SNP Nazis?