I'm not talking about the slightly blue chanting but individuals shouting out obscenities. This season we have had one colourful individual at the back of the Rookery shouting effing useless c--t to Anya in particular. Like all parts of the ground we have many women and children within earshot. Must say the Elton John stand was great yesterday, plenty of atmosphere but without the hassle.
I think if someone does it occasionally then it's one thing but to have people doing it at volume constantly is quite another. Although I'll admit to using it now and again I do cringe when the C word is screamed out. The SEJ looked great yesterday.
On my all-too-rare trips to The Vic I sit in the Rookery, and have to admit that some of the language makes me cringe. It did put off one of my sons when I was trying to initiate him in the delights of the 'Orns as a ten year old - he didn't want to come again. Apart from objecting to the language, I really don't see how anyone hurling obscenities at a player in the team they purport to support can actually call themselves a fan - to my mind it serves no clear purpose.
I have to say I don't like it. Surprisingly perhaps we get it in the upper GT, more often than not directed at our own team. Over the years complaints have been made to stewards with no response but a timid request for them to desist. On other occasions folk have travelled two or three rows in order to threaten to punch their lights out. That stops the problem for a little longer, but not permanently. On Saturday a 4-year-old sat next to me with his granddad who told them at half time that the little boy, clapping and cheering every Watford move, didn't understand why the people behind were so angry with Watford players. They had no answer, not even a sorry. "It's a man's game...go to the ballet if you don't like it," one said at the end. I shall not be sitting in my seat of 20-odd years next season and the one thing I won't miss is the brain-deads behind.
please dont let the brain dead put you off we should all stand up and tell them its our club to . Our club knows that the kids of today are the paying fans of tomoow so we need them in there hundreds
A few years back i had some of the wife's family over from the US. So i took my son-inlaw and his 10 and 8 year olds to the vic I warned them that there could be some swearing the 10 year old told me that he knew all the words and when not to use them his dad and the 8 year old did not say anything lol
I recognise a few 50 plus foul mouthed souls around the ground,from my school days in 'emel , they have not changed . I was in the LGTstand for the Birmingham game ..had 2 very young lads sitting nearby , must have been around 4-5 years old ..they enthusiastically shouted out their support throughout the entire first half .. second half they both were asleep at one stage . Very sweet .
I try and use it to teach Mini Bloother what is not acceptable. He's been going for several seasons now and has heard it all, so he knows that just because it's a football match it is not acceptable. As for the negativity, I have long wondered why fans target particular players. I've seen Eustace and Damian Francis targeted in recent seasons and I do wonder whether all clubs have these 'fans'.
Call me 'new fashioned' but I don't have a major problem with swearing. I don't think swearing at the players is acceptable because a fan doesn't put down their own imo but swearing at the ref, the linos or the opposition players and fans is not a bad thing, though constant repetition of the 'c' word can be a bit much. I think its far more accepted in the Rookery than any other stand. I told my kids it's ok to swear at football, but not anywhere else! When my youngest was 12 she told me she wanted to swear at the ref, i told her she could.. Then she asked me what she should say! It made me chuckle! She doesn't swear constantly, just now and again, and would never do it outside the ground (while I'm in earshot!). I don't have a problem with swearing though, it's just expressive language in my book, if used selectively and not excessively.
The targeting of players gets me.... absolutely ridiculous..... swaring generally is perhaps ok... but not I suggest in the family stand etc etc But the saddos who abuse their pet hates.... ridiculous... and some guy near me was doing it at Forest in an amazing crowd with us winning 3-1
Kids hear swearing in the films they watch, the songs they listen to, the games they play, the school they go to, the buses they take, basically everywhere. I don't agree with constant swearing, but you have to be realistic. Football is a passionate game and people swear (especially after a few pints and a dodgy ref's performance). The only thing that's unnacceptable in a football stadium is racism, rude songs and shouting rude words are just part of watching a game. Saying that, I never swear if there are kids around me.
In the older days of standing terraces you could simply walk away, or rather choose which parts of the ground you wanted to be in. The singers could go together, those who wanted to bounce (knees up mother Brown !) could go together - and, presumably those who wanted to swear loudly (or smoke !) could do the same. Now those groups are much more dispersed - all paying 30 odd quid and thinking that they have a right to 'be themselves'. I do not imagine that anybody will ever sigh patiently and say ' Oh dear, our team have just conceded 2 own goals in the last 2 minutes of the game - how very remiss of them, still, better luck next time` rather they will have a good blow out. If you are not in an area reserved for families then you need to accept that football is a game involving emotions, and often frustrations - a chance to let off steam and act in a way which is different to the rest of the week. Having said that the constant targetting of filthy abuse either towards certain players (or the referee) is not acceptable - together with racist or homophobic content. Still - what is 'foul' language ? Why is it ok. to cast serious doubts upon the sexual dispositions of the referee - but not to call him a ****er ? And after all I would rather be called that than a Tory ! Maybe we should all take eloqution (don't know how to spell that!) lessons in order to get our message over more eloquently - the Shakespearians were excellent at insulting without swearing.
It is odd, maybe just a human trait, why there always has to be a bit of a 'pet hate'. The problem is that once these 'fans' get their pet hate, they look for the bad and no can longer see the good. Parades seems to be the current one where some people can never see the good, and Layun seems to be next. Strange really, because I would have thought we would all want to see all our players do well when playing for our club, instead of almost wanting them too be bad just so that it re-inforces the image a fan has of the player.
Toby - I agree with pretty much all of that. It's just the ones who scream it all through the game that do my nut.
For me, it's a question of time and place. I would very rarely swear whilst sitting in my seat in The Rookery, maybe the odd "FFS" sake at the ref or a player I think is just not up to it (I don't call it a pet hate as it's not a question of hate, just that I think a particular player is not playing well at the moment and there is a better option on the bench. But if someone around me is continually swearing, bitching and moaning, then I will let them know to "give it a rest". I think it's up to ourselves, to police this. Away games it is usually different and we cannot choose our neighbours, but again, it's up to ourselves to sort it out. I have taken Little Miss W_Y home and away for years and she is used to swearing, but if I hear the C word being used a lot, then I will challenge that person.
I once got into a long running argument on the old BBC site on this subject, so I will not revisit it. Despite having a full selection of words in two languages available, I just don't see the point of it. Something to do with people having a limited vocabulary I think, but then I have not been reconstructed.
Done that, Brian. On one occasion the steward called threatened to put me out for causing trouble! You're right...they need to be told but there will always be a minority who confuse their right to an opinion with the right of others not to have to listen to their abuse.
To some extent I agree H. I love language in general and hate censorship. All words have their place. That said, some anatomical and scatological terms don't seem particularly appropriate when applied to football. It's probably not the swearing per se I find objectionable, it's who it's directed at. Fans cursing their own players still mystifies me. But then I'm old enough to remember that if I swore in front of my dad or my teachers I'd probably have got a thick ear!
I think that when it comes to families and children being exposed to this then I am more worried about some of the things which they see happening on the pitch than the reactions of some fans (unless those fans are also aggressive). I would rather have to explain a bit of robust language to my son than have him watching players like Luis Suarez and thinking that it's all ok.
Swearing is acceptible on the pitch and at match officials...it must be as nothing is done about it...so why not in the stands? Just playing devils advocate. I presume the vocal critisism of our own players is, like swearing, bourne out of frustration. But I still dont entirely get it.
