You answered your own question within two lines of text. Also I'm not saying he's comparable to the Mourinho's or Ferguson's...but he's undoubtedly a top manager.
Well we must have very different definitions of what constitutes a 'top manager'. I'd say he's akin to Benitez who I rate as a good manager, but not top class. Winning the league with Bayern when the wealth and financial power they have far exceeds every other side in the division is not a massive achievement. In the same way that you would not label anyone who wins the SPL with Celtic as a ''top manager''.
So i'm guessing the elite managers are currently performing at a consistently high standards, winning top honours. My list would include: - Guardiola - Simeone - Maureen - Klopp? (currently a bad season but has consistently performed over a number of years) - Wenger? - Arsenal are currently resurgent and seem to be making real improvement. Retain FA Cup, finish second and beat Maureen could bring him back to Elite status Any others?
I'd say the elite five are Simeone, Mourinho, Guardiola, Klopp, Ancelotti. Next rung down you have Wenger, Enrique (could be elite in a couple of seasons), Garcia (elite if he can crack it under the high pressure of a bit team), Van Gaal, Conte, Emery, Low, De Boer(?) (could be elite if did something with a club), Bielsa etc. A few in that second rung aren't far off great things in a few years.
I thoroughly disagree with this. It's true Bayern are a financial powerhouse but the Bundesliga is now arguably THE most competitive league in Europe. (and has been that way for a few years) UEFA are looking to give Germany one of our Champions League spots and for good reason the whole league now is strong.
Hes only managed around half of those 15 years at clubs and during that time hes won titles in Holland (imagine Ipswich winning the premier league) and Germany (have a gander at Bayern under Klinsmann). He took the worst dutch side in years to 3rd place in the world cup. Dismantled the current champions in the process. None of this takes away from the years before then when what achieved made Pep and Jose look like small fry. I have no idea why these are so easily dismissed. Its possibly the most impressive thing a manager has ever done... Dominating Europe with Ajax. So whike hes not the very best, few have a cv to match, few have the consistency to match. Is he better than Wenger? Unquestionably so. Wengers been in yhe league years, van Gaal months. There's a point in it but Wenger didn't havr a rebuild to take care of. I rate Wenger too. Unlike half of you on here. He just lacks a killer instinct.
Based on what? 2nd place wolfsburg getting dicked by useless Everton? You seem to overrate quite a lot of things EDIT replied to the wrong person! This reply was for bear
Yes it is. Perhaps the EPL is still more competitive but its close.. and the Bundesliga is going to take over as the best league in Europe. After last month's disappointments, only three English clubs have reached the Champions League quarter-finals in the past four seasons. No English team progressed beyond the last 16 in the 2012-13 and 2014-15 seasons. Only one English side (Chelsea, who won it in 2012) has reached the semi-finals in the last four years. During that time German side Bayern Munich have made the semi-finals in four of the last five years. Germany are also fairing FAR better than us in the UEFA Cup despite having less teams in the competition In the last five years of the Champions League, the German Bundesliga has produced 40% of finalists and Spain's La Liga 30%, with the Premier League lagging behind at 20%.- again despite the fact we have MORE teams in the competition. The current Bayern side are IMO the best team in Europe.The German academies are churning out TOP talent. The league is exciting to watch and full of quality teams.
That's not the same as Alkmaar winning the league. His win percentage was pretty good with them in all fairness, but he doesn't have the accolades to match. I already said he did a good job with the Dutch national side, but they were not the worst Dutch side in years. You're trying to say to me a Dutch side containing a peak Arjen Robben, Sneijder, van Persie, de Jong, Huntelaar, Depay, Lens, de Jong, Vlaar and de Guzman are the worst players they've had in years? Considering a lot of these players have got Premiership experience and have played for top sides in competitive leagues? Some of these players may not have fancy names, but they were not the worst in years. This isn't true. I agree that he did an excellent job for Ajax. This however was around 20 years ago. It has no relevance to now. Agree. Still not convinced he's an 'elite' manager though. Wenger didn't have a rebuild to take care of? I've given the man plenty of stick over the years and he has his flaws, but he most certainly did have a rebuilding job to take care of and has done since the Emirates was built. Granted - part of it was his own undoing and we were architects of our own downfall at times, but the fact remains he has had to constantly replace and rebuild with key players leaving all the time. And he's never nearly gotten us relegated unlike van Gaal did with Barcelona. Let me make something clear. I don't think van Gaal, Wenger or Pellegrini are elite managers. They are all good managers, all have proven that throughout different periods of their managerial careers, but none will be in the upper echelon of football managers in history.
Bayern are the only consistent side to remain competitive of all fronts. The others are not. Hence why, aside from Dortmund in the last few years, whoever finished 2nd or tried to compete with Bayern were different each season. There were always surprise packages but Bayern dwarf all the other sides in terms of their stability, finances and player quality. There are still some good sides in the Bundesliga of course e.g. Leverkusen and Wolfsburg. But Leverkusen were blown away by a Man United side that finished 7th and 2nd place Wolfsburg were beaten home and away by Everton, who all of us can agree have had a very mediocre season.
It We could make the same statement about United 4-5 years ago over here and I don't think the league was weaker than it is now. In the past I would agree about Bayern but as someone who watches the Bundesliga (fairly regulary) the quality of the mid table sides has improved dramatically over the last few years. Mainly through youth development. Peps Bayern may look like they are running away with the league but I think they would be just as dominant in the EPL.
van Gaal is credited to some extent in building some of the worlds very best clubs. Now I am not saying he is solely responsible but he played a key part in Ajax, Barcelona and Bayern. While he had a poor second spell at Barcelona, he introduced an idea to them that thay have kept too since. A fully native side trained at Barcelona go on to win the Champions League. At Bayern he got rid of big names and promoted youth. no explanation needed for Ajax. I think hes elite, not just for success but for his ability to build clubs up. His ideology works and brings incredible success to any club that uses it. Some of the top managers around learnt from van Gaal. Both Jose and Pep are on that list. My fellow United fans were worried. Ive been a van Gaal fan since his first Barcelona stint. I know how he works. Theres no better manager for us right now.
You're a united fan which means you should have a slightly better idea of what 'incredible success' means. And Van Gaal has not had it for years. You can't say that Van Gaal is unquestionably better than Wenger when everything you post here is entirely questionable given your biased nature on these forums.
There's no better manage for you right now... Apart from Guardiola, Mourinho, Ancelotti, Simeone and probably Klopp. The ones who are actually elite rather than ones who were when football was black and white.
