That is how most of these Business work i feel, use other peoples money and give them a little return.. Yes i would not mind a loan from PCC but not to totally pay for it out of what they have for the services that are needed. There will be more cuts after the election for all the services i suspect. But a stand is not top priority for me, lets get promoted and back to the Champion ship.. that is were we belong and that will be as far as i want us to go.. stuff the Prem..
I don't know what all the fuss is about to be honest. The proposed build that was. in my opinion. dead in the water before the water was even added, was probably the biggest non starter ever. There was virtually none of what was proposed that was needed in Plymouth and Brent was grasping at straws. The Brettonside thing had nothing to do with it dying a death as it never had any breath to start with. Brent cannot deliver and I hope the Council don't even think about delivering anything for him. They own the ground but have no reason to invest in it. The loan already made to Brent was sound enough as it came from reserves and is worth more to them than the money sitting in a Bank account. Building a proper grandstand makes no sense for them. Brent is a chancer if you ask me and I think his credibility is fast running out with everyone, PCC included. He has delivered absolutely nothing as I've said before and he has a track record for not delivering. His money is made from lumping one set of business debts onto another of his businesses and then closing the one that owes the money down. As these are always limited companies he has no personal responsibility for the debt. Somebody else pays but then again don't they always. Like everyone else, my patients is fast running out.
I disagree sensible, in as far as the HHP scheme was a really good idea. As i live very close to HP (in Peverell) I know the area well. There is no doubt that a cinema/hotel/ice rink etc would be well supported. This is a high density population area with higher than average disposable incomes. No/very few pubs (where I live was established by the Quakers and even my house has a covenant on it preventing the sale of alcohol). IF it was built it would make money, but it is a leap of faith(and a load of money) to turn the vision into reality. Yes I am a JB fan (and i seem to meet him with increasing regularity) but his vision is correct, and his assessment about the Bretonside V HHP is also correct. the only problem is who has the finances to deliver. It appears that JB hasn't, so as much as he wants to, it looks like he cant.
ps whatever anyone thinks about JB the question is obviously would Plymouth be better with a 'sports hub' in central park, or without. To me it is a no brainier.
Not disagreeing with the Sports Hub thing lyndhurst, in my opinion it is the obvious place for one if one is to exist. However, you may not agree that the build to do with the proposed grandstand was a non starter but the rest of the business world seemed to back that up. I don't think Central Park needed a cinema and indeed I don't think Plymouth necessarily needed another one. I don't think it needed a Hotel there either. I definately don't think a School of any description was required and clearly the proposed other "outlets" were not popular with those who might open one. HHP was on the table long before any Brettonside plans were introduced. He had ample opportunity to start the project and probably had he done so then the plans for the bus station would not have been as they are proposed now. However, he couldn't sell it to anyone and it was already dead before the other build was proposed. HHP was already a corps. Brent never funds anything himself and doesn't use his own money ever so unless there is another mug out there to prop up his profit making then it's all wind and water. I'm sure he's a very nice man to talk to but then again so is a Black Widow spider before diner.
Cant really argue about most of that, BUT if it wasn't financially viable then it wasn't going to ever happen. People (including me) need to realise that unless someone comes along with £10+ millions spare cash then the only way anything will be delivered is by brokering a deal with others' money. Like it or not , that is the way the world works. It is unfair to say that anyone he entices on board is a mug...If it is successful it is a win for JG and all the associated investors. The lack of progress says more about the apathy of the people of Plymouth than JBs professional ability.
You two still at it,.....did you two get thrown out of the "Pilgrimage" for not spending enough money.....you two could get arrested sitting in the park drinking your way through that six-pack you bought in the local off-license........
ahh yes, nothing like trying to have a one side arguement/discussion after one or two glasses of grape juice..
Apathy of the people of Plymouth?????? Sorry but what has the failure of the Grandstand work got to do with the people of Plymouth? Hardly anyone who was a supporter of the Club thought that the plans for the ground were any good. Some of them went to the trouble of doing a lot of work to produce an alternative but this was dismissed out of hand by Brent and he refused to even consider it. The football was rubbish, the results were rubbish and the plans for the ground were rubbish yet over 6000 people continued and still continue to support the club every home game. Looking at the rest of the league I call that committment rather than apathy. The fact that people don't generally like the way Brent conducts his business isn't apathy either it is a lack of trust based on what they see. What they see is a lack of anything happening yet they are asked to continue to support and do. The "Janner" can be blamed for a lot of things but this time I don't agree.
a. they weren't bang to rights- both declined to be interviewed after the decision to allow the coach station planning to go ahead. Instead the rubbish local news showed an old video of them walking round the perimeter of the pitch- not sure what point it was supposed to make but IMO it failed. b. It is an old chestnut-if insufficient people turn up week in week out then the grandstand wont be built. My apathy comment was based on the fact that out of a population of 250000 only 6000 can be bothered to pay on a weekly basis. The rest will stand back and find a reason to criticise the chairman, board and anyone else that actually makes an effort to move the club forward. Everyone claims that we should be at least an upper half of L1 team and probably a solid championship team- and I agree. This can happen, but if it is a real belief then the gates need to be much bigger - look at Portsmouth, they are a struggling L2 team but have genuine and proper support. Don't think for 1 minute that I am decrying the genuine supporters (i am one of those) but they probably don't amount to more than about 5000. I know this is boring but you have to go back to the basics-the grandstand will only be built if it is financially viable. It matters not who the chairman is (unless they have £millions they don't care about). Brent kept the club going- come up with a better alternative and he and i will welcome him with open arms. 6000 'janners ' turning up for 3 hours 23 days of the year ain't going to get a grandstand built or sustain a football club-hence the apathy statement. Just to wind you up a bit more, I am clearly from 'oop north' but lived here for 30 years. Still not accepted as a local. Plymothians seem to have this strange superior attitude that everyone else owes them a favour and nothing is their fault. It is . They /we need to catch up with the rest of the world.
Chicken/egg....egg/chicken. We can compare crowd sizes all night long and City population sizes but it doesn't really tell all of the story. You could argue that successive Argyle Owners have believed the crowds should come before they put anything much into the playing part or ground. If you want an audience in an entertainment industry then surely you have to give the punters what they want to see rather than the other way around. Pompey have been there hence the current crowds we never have. I remember well that the asset stripper, sorry that would be administrator, said there was no alternative to Heaney until Heaney blew it and suddenly there was an alternative after all in Brent. Had the Administrator earned his money properly, in my opinion, then who is to know who might have turned up. Brent cannot live on this premis that everyone should be grateful to him for evermore. Given what has been served up as entertainment in previous seasons he should be grateful himself that so many bothered to turn up. You are never ever accepted as a local anywhere unless you are really a local.
They showed actual footage of Brent stating when he was going to start his many projects and that he had failed to start any of them ...... Why didn't he want to explain himself ? probably because it wasn't the pro Herald ! We don't think we are superior Lyndy what we get sick and tired of are people who try and play us as idiots ..... why do you think many of the big bands of the day had their first gig down here ..... we are a tough audience and if we know someone is playing us for fools woe betide them !
Not sure much of this is to do with with JB anymore. Yes he made the huge mistake of publishing what his vision was- It was a good idea but is not going to happen.(lack of faith by PCC/ plymouth in general). He and the rest of the directors don't owe the good people of Plymouth anything, so if i were him I would walk away and let 'Plymouth' have the team they deserve/want. Clearly everyone else will come together and raise enough to propell the club to the Championship. In the real world, I suspect that JB is fed up with bank-rolling the club so either he walks away, gets some support and develops the site, or sells the club to one of the people in the £millionaires queue to buy it.(Oh there aren't any). It is very much a case of 'put up or shut up'.
Two things wrong with that statement lyndhurst. The first is that Brent has bankrolled anything because from where I'm standing his money isn't at risk as far as I can see. The second is that the club isn't up for sale or at least not to my knowledge. Ergo nobody has a clue who may or may not come out of the woodwork should it be. There may yet be a queue. I also think that PCC has bent over backwards or at least as far as it can considering it's not actually their cash so to say they have a lack of vision is being a bit disingenuous. It's Brent that has delivered precisely nothing that is the problem not PCC standing in his way. If it makes him look a plonker then it is his own doing rather than the fault of the locals.
must have been before my time jools but i dont remember them. The most respected thing we have is the Theatre Royal which is recognised nationally and hence gets a lot of west end shows. We should be much better as a city. Some people are working very hard to achieve this but the commitment to the football club seems to be lagging behind.
I think you will find that JB has bankrolled the club to quite a large extent over the last three years (I appreciate that I may have some insider knowledge about this) and perhaps he doesn't want to for much longer.... If someone came in with sufficient cash to payback the money 'the club' owes to JB and stabilise the club further, then fairly sure he would sell. Everything is always up for sale(at the right price).
Sorry Lyndy I am with Sensible over his statement that PCC have bent over backwards to help Brent .... People like Joe and his family, people with Learning Disabilities and many more vulnerable people are having their services cut to the bone and if its a choice between helping Brent or the people and services which really do need the money then I'm sorry its a no brainer where I want the money to go.
It's all very well having something that is respected but the price of entry is a bit steep. The wages in this part of the Country are not comparable to most who go to west end shows. Same could be said for entry to Home Park. My reasoning ref the bankrolling is that everything "known" has a security attached and doesn't leave Brent exposed to loss personally. With all due respect lyndhurst to have insider information on his finances, other than him telling you he had done this or that and you taking him at his word, is for you to be his Bank Manager or Accountant. To be fair he hasn't exactly been transparent with it all has he or else you wouldn't have the suspicion that exists now. It is a bit of a myth regarding what any Council can and can't spend on services Mrs J. The money they have loaned Brent for example is from reserve funds which Councils are obliged to have. It cannot spend all of it's capital or believe me many Councils would have done so and gone bust previously. The fact is that the loan given is accruing better interest as a loan (but still part of the reserve even though it isn't physically sat in the Bank) than it would have in the Bank account. It was good business for everybody and not done just to prop Brent up. The repurchase of the ground was also decent business financially when Brent took over Argyle. If it wasn't then you would find the Councillors in serious trouble. However, PCC has bent over backwards to not hinder Brent in anyway which in itself is supporting the Club.
