You have missed a key point. CAST has said that all questions and points must be raised through them first - even though 90% plus of Charlton fans would rather have carnal knowledge with a corpse than join CAST.
Surely not! Where have they said that, Vol? Sorry, CAST, but that ain't gonna happen, not with the present mood among Charlton fans!
Said by CAST member Rikofold- not the only crass comment he came out with last week, either. Certain people getting well ahead of themselves over this Hot Air Convention.
I think it has the potential to be a lively meeting. After another 2 home games of watching the Luzon Crouch, and LePoint making his mandatory subs appearance, maybe one point from the 2 games, there is the possibility that a strong anti-roland speech could ignite the place, a bit like Norman Tebbitt's electrifying anti-Brussels speech all those years ago. And if that happens it won't come from any of the usual suspects.
Two posts below from CAST Grandees Seriously Red and Rikofold, which make me think the event is now more about CAST than odinary fans getting heard: SeriouslySelfImportantRed On a different note, Katrien Meire doesn't talk to the Trust because she's been told not to. Any airtime she gave the Trust would legitimise it in the eyes of the fans and thus boost its credentials and membership. Duchatelet doesn't want a strong Trust because if the Trust shows the analysis and maturity it has exhibited this year then it can become a very powerful adversary making a robust case for a different approach. To be specific, the Trust have not gone piling in and has waited for the transfer window to close and that game on Saturday. But they are not waiting for the inevitable down turn in season ticket sales to get involved. And then Rikofold's gem: I'm a member of all three of those forums. Not sure any of the forum admins would ever fully represent my views. This is the problem, and if every individual who wanted to say something was accommodated the meeting would take a week. Even if you felt each forum could be represented, there is a question of the size of that - not606's match thread got 250 views compared to 30k on here for example. It's an almost impossible job for the Supporters' Trust, who will be criticised whatever. Personally speaking I'd encourage anyone who feels they have something to say in representation of a group of supporters to contact the Supporters' Trust and lay it all out, what you want to say, why it should be you, etc. Give us a chance to ensure we have the breadth of coverage that will be needed and to plan timings. But, if the drive to be heard is solely self serving, or "if they can speak I should be allowed" then the point is being missed isn't it? Sorry - but since when did not elected pompous windbags from CAST have the right to pre-judge the views of posters on here ? Have I missed something?
The trust or Bovril circle have already said that any anti Belgium rhetoric or racist chat will not be tolerated and the speakers will be asked to leave. The Bovrils intend to enforce any such transgression by letter at first and then voted in by senior memebers at a later date. They forget that when the Supporters Club did the same back in sellout times, a few of our bigger boys just told then to fack off and took over. This is what will happen and it should.
....because in their heart of hearts everybody hates the network, but are flummoxed by roland's soul-less contempt and stubbornness. It would take one good speech to ignite that feeling.
A good idea to keep the meeting wthin the laws of the land, I would have thought? The Supporters Trust needs to persuade the owner and CEO that the club will be more successful if they are in a dialogue with supporters. Those who moronically want to yell 'BELGIANS AND ALL FOREIGN PLAYERS OUT' at the top of their shrill voices as a substititute for doing anything constructive, like its a Socialist Workers party demo, will need to be given the bum's rush.
Keep it clean guys. It's been an interesting read thus far and that's where we'll keep it. Reams numbers game is boring - he has little man syndrome in respect to CL. I'd rather do what we do than have people sign up to tell me how horribly inaccurate I am 99% of the time. Or to dig me out for being vocal but not attend games. But the match day topic point is interesting - comparing us to CL was a little disrespectful IMO and seemingly came across as belittling what we do on here. Funnily enough I had some of the Rangers guys contact me about the trust and I put them in the right direction as I made it clear it's not something I'm involved with, nor will I be. So every forum has it's strengths. There were hundreds of fans at Middlesborough - was anything done to target them?
The bottom line is that once again we have a situation where one group of supporters have decided that they have the right to edit/censor what another group of supporters says/thinks. This mindset is like a virus among our supporter cliques. I would rather stick my wotsit in the oven than ever kow tow to unelected CAST non entities about what may or may not be said.
At what point could a point be considered as 'racist?' Does simply mentioning that with the exception of 3 players, all the ones from Standard Liege and the network has been below par. It could be the large disparity in the leagues in which the Belgium Pro League is just not as good as the English Championship? To me, I think that, that is a very valid point and a huge criticism of his network, and the main reason why we need a manager whom is familiar with the Championship or even won promotion. Outside of Aitor Karanka, are there any "PROVEN" foreign managers (and yet, good as he might be, he's not won a promotion or a cup)?
Don't often get off my perch on this site to harangue anybody and not likely to do so now. The trust have called an open meeting and so long as it stays an open meeting with everybody invited to attend and participate then I have no problem with it. Like many on here, I have no time for the trust given the nonsense they have spouted in the past, but if you don't LISTEN, to what is being discussed then you can't have a view on the outcome. The trust appears full of Bovril lovers but sometimes even those people can get to the end of their tether with the rubbish we are being served up as football at the moment. What is needed is an independent chairman not a trust member to ensure the meeting is run on equitable lines and is not dominated by one group. Those attending should respect the views of others that differ from their own. Will that happen, I sincerely doubt it given the preamble we have seen here and elsewhere but we should all give it a chance. I think it unfair of any of us on here to demand that Dick or Nick to represent all of us either, if we have a view we should attend and make it heard. As to the squabbling over whose site has more hits, somebody should grow out of the kindergarten. I am on here and not on other sites because I don't have the time to keep u with the mega posters on CL most of whom I cant get to grips with in any logical form, I am not a believer in the ITTV style forum and post o here because I occasionally have the time to do so and deal with the reaction. The meeting should not be one of "I represent x supporters" since none of us have been elected (including the trust) to represent anybody. We should focus on what we have in common, support for CAFC, and not what divides us. I am trying to ensue that I am in the right part of the country to attend the meeting at the planned time and will not be representing any of you, only myself and my views, as bizarre as they may be. Do I believe RD will listen to anything I say, probably not, do I believe he will listen to anything the trust says, probably not. The aim of the meeting has to be to get a consensus amongst us all as to what we want to do and to achieve. If that is a way to make RD an offer he cant refuse, then it would have my backing, but I am not certain we could get a consensus of all parties when all some want to do is be critical and not be constructive following the criticism. Do we want a co-ordinated protest - then that should be the raison d'etre of the meeting and should be put on the agenda My concern remains that we do not have an agenda or chairman for the meeting and the net result is that it could be a disaster or provide RD with a pyrrhic victory. A chairman, agenda and proposals need to be put together before it becomes a disastrous talking shop.
I think the Belgian thing is a blind alley. It does'nt matter where they come from. Yann was'nt British but he was great. Jose Riga had no championship experience, but he knew enough about football to turn a downhill avalanche into a successfull relegation fight and keep us up. The problem with the Network is'nt the Belgians per se, it's the mindset that only looks along the line of the trench and selects people who are already 'in the platoon', even if they've been found wanting on other occasions. With the money RD has, he could recruit on simple quality, but he prefers to stick to his old boy network plus untried youth, and thinks he's doing a clever thing while the stadium empties. The problem is also that football is an alternative universo, and in a situation like ours, you need players with pllocks, players like Kinsella, Costa or Hales, who would dig in and battle. Buyens, Bulot and sadly it seems Igor, are not buldog breed, and that's not their nationality, it's just they are'nt equipped for the championship. Neither is RD .
I'd like to take this opportunity to apologise for creating such a woeful match thread this weekend, and then making it worst by talking to myself about hoovering in it and accidentally disrespecting Peter Finch. I've let myself down and most importantly everyone else here too. It won't happen again (except for the Peter Finch but). On a serious note though this thread and the differing articulate opinions within have been a joy to read; each point from each poster has been so rational that they always leave a little bit to think about. And that's before we eventually hear the rallying crystal of Ponders. Well done everyone. It's a shame we didn't start the Trust first...
I mean seriously guys. We're trying to organise a public meeting which facilitates the views of a wide spectrum of people. Do you seriously believe this would be best left to chance on the night? It would be like herding cats. In order to facilitate it, we need to know who wants to speak and who wants to say what - otherwise we could miss out on important messages no-one else is saying, or simply get the same old faces saying the same old things. That's what I'm saying, nothing more, nothing less. The thing is if you can't bring yourself to accept our genuine intent to facilitate that discussion, then everything else will be seen through a lens of 'they're lying'. That's up to you, I can but try. Frankly Royston's being more than disingenuous on this. He appealed to me on ITTV to come on here so this forum wouldn't feel left out of things. I've done that, and now he's having a free-for-all with my words, taking them out of context, including those spoken on a different forum, and generally insulting me. I didn't come here for an argument, I came here to include you. Seriously, I don't need to come here to argue with Royston, I could do that on ITTV - it wouldn't be the first time. I have no issue presenting my views myself, I don't need Royston or anyone else to twist my words. My personal view on forums is that by their very nature they are not clubs where everyone agrees - and thus it's a bit difficult to ask any moderator to speak on behalf of everyone. Notwithstanding, ensuring groups of fans have their say is important and that's why I've come on here to include you in the discussion. You're not even of one mind on this thread! Anyway, at the start of this thread there was a complaint that no-one wanted to talk to you. When I've come to talk to you, you complain we want to control your message when it's plainly obvious that this meeting needs to be organised or it will be fruitless. We're starting from a no-win position for you, so feel free to carry on slagging off individuals who actually want the same as you for our club. What you get out of it, God alone knows.
I don't think we're any different to most fans - both us and ITTV have asked for an agenda, and the questions been raised more than once on facebook and Twitter. I think you'll find the same question if you canvass outside tomorrow. Basically, the post seemed a little defensive? Excluding you and nick (I don't care for what happens elsewhere), there appears to have been some genuine questions/concerned asked. Ok maybe you can't elaborate further than you have, you made that point. But then I think the comment on CL that was addressed on here was a sure fire way to make those already dubious, question the CAST more. I understand they're important to your cause, but at the expense of other CAFC fans/sites? Interesting.
