I've shown that our goals conceded is actually better this year than last but its goals scored or the lack thereof thats put us where we are now.
Goals win games. Defences win titles. If we continue to score goals and neglect the defence, then we're merely masking the same issues we had last season. With a quality defence, we wouldn't to score 2-3 goals every game. And even with our depleted attack, Sterling, Coutinho, Lallana, Markovic and hopefully soon, Sturridge are capable of creating chances to score at least 1 goal each game.
Our defending has improved over the past few games and we've been winning more games. It was the shocking tactics and defending earlier this season which put us in this position. That's not to say that the attack doesn't need improving though.
Obviously you need to have a balance between attack and defence. But I suggest you look throughout the history of this sport, look at past league winners and you'll find that most of them were in the top 4 in their respective leagues for least goals conceded And just because you have a good defence doesn't mean that you draw games. It then allows you to have a poor game and nick the odd goal and win - that's on a bad day! As I say, you need to have a balance.
No, scoring more goals than the opposition wins games. I get the impression you'd love to see us play extremely boring negative football winning most games 1-0 each week. I wouldn't. I like winning trophies under Houllier for example but the football was ****ing painful. Give me attacking footballing every single day of the week, even if it means we don't win as much. Football is supposed to be entertaining, not a chore!
This is the problem - everyone assumes being able to defend well is boring and negative. It's an attitude that has developed since Sky placed emphasis is on scoring goals, last ditch tackles, speed etc, and where awards are only given to attackers. The analysis on tactics and defending is minimal in this country. Defending as a unit is an art which appears to be lost. But being able to defend does not mean you don't/can't score many goals. Yes, aggressive football is nice to watch and is exciting. But do you know what's better than that? Winning. And winning titles. If you're happy watching us score 3-4 goals every game and not win anything then fair enough.
The Milan/Juventus teams of old were brilliant defensively but played good football. Ajax under Michels and Cruyff developed a philosophy which re-defined the game in all aspects. Pep's Barca and Bayern were built on defending as a unit, but combined with attacking as one unit.
Where did I say a good defence is always boring and negative...? I said I get the impression you'd like it
if you go to spain the amount of "shots" is less but amount on target and goals scored is higher. they like to pass it make a better chance and be patient and they like to defend better too... After all this is why the english clubs are crap in europe.
We had a brilliant defense in 2008/09 season lost only two games but the reason we lost that league to united is because we drew so many games where if we had more one extra class striker we'd have taken the damn thing. United that Season had Rooney , Ronaldo ,Tevez and Berbatov. We had Gerrard and Torres as players who could match up to United's attack. Manchester United Played 38 Won 28 Drawn 6 Lost 4 GF 68 GA 24 Pts 90 Liverpool Played 38 Won 25 Drawn 11 Lost 2 GF 77 GA 27 Pts 86 See all those draws right over there? It is because we did not lose the games via not conceding more. We lost the league because we were unable to turn some of those games into wins. Goals scored will most likely win you the league than goals conceded. It is the reason why City dramatically beat United to the title it is the reason why even though we scored 101 league goals last season, City scored 102.
And then look at us last season - I would argue had we not conceded that many goals, we would have walked to the title. And in the Rafa season - at the point, it was the highest points tally by a team not to win the league. Any other season prior to that, and it would have been enough - it was certainly a title challenging approach that Rafa adopted.
And you assume I like boring defensive football because I appreciate solid defending ... However, I was very much in the 'aggressive, attacking' camp not too long ago. I felt football should be entertaining (as Cruyff said) - however, history dictates that a great defence is behind every great team. There is one exception to this - I can't remember the season but United had the 6th best defence when they won the league. However, that was due to a very poor 1st half of the season. After xmas, they went on a great run and their defence conceded only a handful of goals after that.
Nor did I say I assumed you did like boring defensive football or imply that you actually did, I said I get the impression you would like it. The reality is, both our attack and defence needs to improve and we're merely debating which should take priority. My opinion is based on seeing us last year and Man Utd this year (bit of an assumption here) getting top four due to have excellent attacking players regardless of a **** defence. We were close to the title last year but you rightly say the defence cost us. At the moment, we are miles away from that position. At the moment we need to concentrate on getting top four. Having more goals int he team will achieve that aim. That's not to say defending better won't do that either but it not exactly confidence filling when we need ten chances to score a single goal!
My opinion is degree of improvement needed for example: a dour side can win quite a few 1-0 like stoke under pulis.. it only gets you so far. These "best sides" i am hearing about winning stuff have boht the attack and defenses. The sides who have the attack but concede too many end up in 4th.. which aint too abd compared to where we are at. in realy we have been quite average this year in terms of goals thrown in and goals scored. we have let in 27 goals. thats not great by the top4 THIS SEASON... but in reality arsenal have leasked 25, westham 27, spurs 30, city have leaked 22! its just average. yes it must improve. But... upfront we have only recently got more goals. we have now got 31... that's a measurable increase on where we were and why we are improving in the table. everyone above us has scored a bit more however... not much but a bit. All you need do is look down the table at everton who can't stop throwing them in and are on 23 points. We have passed them and kept going because we have actually improved our defense via a system change but also our goals scored. I would contend however LFC need to add a real goal scorer between coutinho and sterling upfront be it sturridge or someone as we miss too many chances and i firmly believe that in general play our defense is reasonable but we must have a sweeper keeper who a real presence at the back to short things up there as a lot of the chances we cough up are pure panic. right now we are just about competitive via putting in lads who will work for us. to take the next step we need prob 20/30% more goals for and take 10/15% goals away off the conceded tally. you don't get 30% more goals with DMs and RCBs. We are all hoping sturridge can bag about ten goals from now til seasons end.
I'd actually contend that this is 90% right but the one extra class striekr should read "robbie keane scored a lot of goals but rafa was so insistant of getting rid due to parry buying him that he threw him out and then promplty found torres injured" We lost the league in 08/09 as torres and gerrard both got injured and we'd sold keane back to spurs ridiculously without a replacement. Babel played up front and we lost 2-0 at boro and draw 1-1 with an awful wigan team. had we even retained keanes and not treated hm that badly we'd have won the thing i beleive. If you look back at that seaosn we actually kept pace with chelsea right up til they imploded but then we failed to kick on and utd came on strong... the league was over by the time we played utd at old trafford. the 4-1 still elft it in thier hands the 4-4 v arsenal was merely a last nail in the coffin.
11 draws Jimmy was the reason rafas team did not win the league because at times the difference between a draw and win is the brilliance of your attackers rather than your defense
Of course - but looking at the context and in most seasons, we would have won the league with that points tally - so having a quality defence that season ensured that we at least challenged for the title. As MITO says - you need to have both attack and defence. It's no point having one without the other because you won't achieve much. You can argue that Soton haven't got an amazing attack but their defensive set up is brilliant and it's helped them build a platform this season. They would have ended up higher last season had Wanyama not been injured.
